[0:00] Today's program has been brought to you by White Oak Pastures, a 5 generation Georgia-based beef and poultry farm determined to conduct business in an honorable manner. For more information, visit whiteoakpastures.com. You are listening to Heritage Radio Network broadcasting live from Bushwood, Brooklyn. If you like this program, visit heritageradionetwork.org for 1000s more.

[0:27] Cooking issues.

[0:52] Calling your questions, two! Cooking issues. Hello and welcome to Cooking Issues. This is Dave Arnold, your host of Cooking Issues, coming to you live from Aberta's Pizzeria in Bushwick, Brooklyn, on the

[1:08] Harris Radio Network. Joined as usual, witness Dasha. Hammer, Lopez. How you doing, Stas? I've got Evan in the control booth today, right? How you doing, Evan? Good, how are you? You ever, you don't talk much on the air. No, I'm been a quiet guy. Yeah, quiet guy. So are we saying, Stas, when I rudely interrupted you, as is my want? Nothing. Yeah? Anything good going on? No, I was, I was just... Looking up the A class of recipe that I asked you to look up

[1:32] the, uh, oh, and you're looking through. We got the shows you that have never written a book before, which was me

[1:38] until like a month ago. The publisher comes out with this thing called A Blood. A book layout and design thing. So we're just looking, it just came in the blads for the new cocktail book coming out in November,

[1:51] November, November. You know who else's books are coming out in November. And for those of you that don't, like, it takes forever to get a book out because they, like, even though it's already done, they, they go through a bunch of revisions and copy

[2:04] editing, and then they send it overseas to get printed, and then it has to get shipped back, and they need to have it in the country for a little while before they ship it out,

[2:11] ba, ba, ba, ba, ba. So when you're going through a kind of traditional publishing route. It sure does take a long time. Doesn't that seem like it takes longer than you think of what's does? Yeah definitely. Especially because it's like it's done now. We're done with it. We're done. And then now we like, we just wanted, wanted to come out. But we have some good friends with books coming out in November. I can't remember all of them, like a bunch of good ones, like Brooks. His book is coming out in October, November, the same

[2:33] publisher. That hit pressure cooking book coming out, a bunch of good stuff coming out. Anyways, anything good happen the past couple days? Anything horrible? No? No? No, that's good. Nothing good, nothing horrible. I got this one off of the Twitter sent in. It's not a question. It's more just a, hey, check this out. Uh, from uh, at Jim Guarneri writes to us. Uh, and I haven't told you about this yet, Styles, because I want to get your direct reaction. So, uh, it's it's from, uh, I don't know whether it's live science or live science. the name of the website, and the reporter is Charles Choi, and writes about this. Baby poop bacteria help make healthy sausages and the tag, the tag, the title line of the article. Pooperoni. It's pooperoni. Because what they're doing is some scientist in England were trying to get the most kind of probiotic. So, you know, when you ferment sausages, right? One of the things you're looking for, well, the primary thing you're looking for is a drop in

[3:28] pH so that you can inhibit unhealthy things from growing in it by having

[3:32] the pH low enough that they won't grow. So typically you get lactic acid bacteria, and they also produce that awesome kind of lactic acid

[3:41] flavor, and then the question as a sausage maker is, where do you fall? Do you like more acidic sausage? A lot of Americans tend to do kind of hardcore, like really hard pH dropped fermented stuff. I think because they like the tang and also because, you know, it definitely helps enhance food safety, whereas, you know, I know a lot of people who also like a really kind of mild, less tangy sausage, but they have to play more with, you know, making sure that they're on the safe side.

[4:05] What do you like better? tangy or not tangy on a fermented sausage? Um, I don't think I care. I like most salsa. You like them both? I don't like it when it gets so, so tangy that the meat kind of gets granular and breaks up weird. You know what I'm talking about? Oh, sometimes I like it. There's some like citrus, some citrus dried sausages with like that have like noticeable acid flavor to them other than just

[4:23] lactic, and those I kind of like, even though they're crumbly. whatever. that's not what I'm talking about here. So the point is that these researchers in the UK, I think it's UK, say, well, listen,

[4:34] who's growing black, they don't talk like that there. They're like, listen, we's growing bacteria and sody sausages anyway. So what if we doped it with some probiotic stuff so that we could say that it helps your intestines? You know, helps you poop her out while you're doing it, right? And so they figured who's got a lot of those, you know, probiotic stuff without a lot of pathogens, babies. And so they, uh, they, I guess, like took a bunch of baby diapers. And cultured stuff out and found some bacteria from the baby diapers that they thought were good and they started inoculating it

[5:00] into making the, uh, pooperoni. What your thoughts? No, I'm just reading this. I mean, what do you, well, you know, now that you, like, 1st blush, would you, you wouldn't have a problem with

[5:09] pooperoni? I mean it's been cultured so many times. Yeah, I'd be fine. Yeah, I mean, San Francisco sourdough, like, you know, one of the one of the main, um, uh, back when they did testing, which is decades ago, uh, they tested for strains of uh, bacteria in

[5:22] the uh, in the sourdough starters. And one of them was, you know, its main substrate is the gums of people with periodontal disease.

[5:29] Yes, I have a problem with that. That's even grosser, right? You'd rather you'd rather pooperoni than the periodontal disease, like, you know. Yeah. Yeah, why? I don't know, like, why is it like that? Oh, uh, well, I mean, look, it's so far removed anyway, and like, you know, the, like the most shocking, the most kind of disturbing passage in modernist cuisine for those of you that have

[5:50] it, is the one where they describe the, the experiment done in the submarine, where

[5:56] they take all the sailors in the submarine, and they give them a, a check in the, you know, a butt, a butt check. They say that on error, they check their butts, and they put a phosphorescent powder in on their behinds,

[6:12] right? And didn't tell them about it. And then a day later, they took a black light and walked around the sub, a submarine, whole freaking submarine lit up

[6:22] like, like a freaking club with a black light, like showing the phosphorescent

[6:26] dust all over the room. used to eating that? I'm saying you are so thoroughly coated with like all kind of like nastiness. People touching their face, people touching their mouth, people touching their butt, people touching the ground, and then wiping it all over every

[6:40] surface, and then you touch that surface. I mean, my thing is, like, look, I got mental issues, like, not just cooking issues, people. I have some mental issues on, like, for instance, public restrooms, like, I can't use it, but I know that it's irrational. I know that my fear and disgust of public restrooms and of touching faucets and

[6:57] knobs in public restrooms and areas like that. I know that it's illogical because I know that that stuff is everywhere, but I just can't kick it, you know? I don't know. What about you? You don't like a public restroom either. Nobody likes a public question. If you like a, I mean, like, I don't know, someone can call him. They're like, oh, by the way, if you do have a question related to cooking, call it in

[7:17] two, 718-497-2128. 718-4972128. Oh, so the tagline is, the baby poop helps actually make the sausage more healthy, more healthy. It also reminds me of the interesting case. Remember that article that McGee sent us about the salt risen bread and the clustradium

[7:32] perfringians and the guys in right after World War one? They had saved some culture from a soldier who had died from gas gangrene, this like

[7:39] custradium that like, you know, like ate this guy's leg and like blew it up with gas and stuff like

[7:42] that and they made bread with it. And they ate it. And they didn't die, apparently. Well, I mean, they're dead now. Now they're dead. At class, Riot wrote in last week, 9 time for the last thing. He says, at cooking issues, if you could read a list of microplane uses that you could think of in the style of John

[8:00] Macheta, that would be great. You remember him? I can't I can't do it. I mean, look, if I had a script and I memorized it. Maybe I could talk as fast as he can, but he's the guy in the FedEx commercial who's like, you know, got

[8:10] it good, got a good deal, deal. Remember this? No, you're too young. Like for any of you that were alive in the 80s. And remember these FedEx commercials. He was like a super fast talking guy on a telephone who would just nonstop like stream of craziness. They're awesome commercials. I just watched them this morning on the YouTube to get a refresher on it and they're still good. I like a commercial. It's still good. No? You know, can't. No, yeah, I'm... All right, so here are some, here are some uses, at class, and these aren't my own uses. These are just, you know, obvious uses for microplane. So by the way, when you buy a microplane before I get into it. You know, there's various different sizes of uh, they're not just physical sizes of the microplane unit itself, but actual uh, differences in the way that the cutting teeth are arranged. They have ribbon slicers. They have coarse slicer, you know, coarse graters, they have fine graters, they have ultrafine for spices and stuff like that. I tend to use mainly just the normal fine one, which I use for zest in that. But I mean, obviously there's a lot more uses if you're getting some of the coarser ones. If you want to great things like apples and carrots. I don't do that much. You use a lot of microplane? Really? Like, you're against it? It just doesn't come out. No, I actually use it for Parmesan cheese. But that's about it. That's it. Okay. So, file, like, most of these things under, under, I didn't come up with any, like, killer ones that I hadn't already known about. I'm sorry about that at class. But anyway, uh, should I, if someone's at clash, I just call them clefts. Yeah. Yeah, class. Yeah, all right. So obviously spices, right? So you got your your nutmeg, your cinnamon, your balonies, long pepper, your grains of salim, or as they say

[9:41] in a wool of jerk. what are hard spices you got? Probably a lot of hearts, but any hard spice that's big enough to hold in your hand, you could do, right? Me, pretty much. I wonder where the cola nuts would be good. I don't really like cola nuts, but I bet you could grate them. Anyways, uh, obviously any hard product, uh, fatty hard product like chocolate or hard cheese, duh, zest, uh, any any kind of zest. I mean, duh, horseradish, if you want a real fluffy horserash, although I wouldn't do it with

[10:05] wasabi because I don't think it can grate it fine enough. However, if you have another mortar and pestle thing, but you don't have like the, like the good old shark skin thing to grade into a fine paste

[10:15] wasabi, a good approximation is to take the wasabi, grade at 1st in a microplane, and then grind it in a regular mortar and pestle, because it breaks down the fibers to the extent that you can get a good paste grind

[10:26] afterwards. Most people don't think about this, but very, very, very few grinding technologies or blending technologies are good at reducing something from a very large particle size to a very small particle size,

[10:39] a whole range of particle size. So sometimes a dual, a dual action thing like that is necessary. Now, the shark skins guys are good because they fundamentally abrade it like sandpaper, but make it easy enough to get the stuff out after it's done. So it's ideal for that. But if you don't have that, you could probably do a pretty good job by microplaning 1st and then mortar and

[10:57] pestling it with a standard Western style mortar and pestle. I wouldn't mean like at home, I don't really use standard mortar and pestles. I have a mochahede I use for things like guacamole and garlic and stuff like that, but it'd be too coarse. I lose so much wasabi and the price would make me so angry. But anyway, horseradish. Other hard stuff like coconuts, but not if you need too much. Can you imagine having to grate all that, all that stuff on the chin, chin, chin? They have the rotary one, but I don't have it. I don't use it. Anyway, also, nut nuts, like larger nuts, if you want like a little bit of grated walnut, grated olvin, things like this. Obviously, things like ginger, fantastic, be with first. Uh, and anything related to ginger, any rhizome related to ginger. So you got your turmeric, you got your galongo, which, you know, people don't use enough fresh galongo. They really don't. Turmeric, we just did a bunch of demos with it. I can understand why you wouldn't want to use fresh turmeric because it stains the hell out of everything. Although I used some, it didn't have as much, you know what I didn't realize is people? turmeric. The amount of flavor seems kind of directly related to the color intensity.

[11:51] So we had a batch that had a very low color intensity, and it had much less flavor per gram than the ones with the higher color intensity. I hadn't realized that. Maybe someone else has some experience for this, and they can tell me. A lot of people do garlic. I don't. You ever garlic? You ever garlic microplane? I've never done it. I mean, I'm sure it would work. But, yeah, I know what I secretly. I hate shopping garlic. I do too. I hate it. I hate it so much. I like handing it off with somebody. I hate it. you know what I hate? I hate that. I hate that weird sugary sticky paper sticks to you and the paper sticks to the knife after you smash it. I just don't like it. I don't like smashing it. I don't like, I just don't like dealing with it. I really don't. I mean, I love the flavor of it, but, you know, maybe I'll try to think. Okay. I've never tried katsobushi, but I'm sure it would work. You know, obviously not for what you normally use it for in Dashi, but if you wanted

[12:40] to like grate a little bit of Kaso Bushi over the top of something, I'm sure that'd be great. Thats dry bonito for you other folks out there. I have tried it with dried Chinese scallops and it's fantastic for that. a finishing thing. I've tried it with botarga, which is great because botarga is so freaking expensive that you want something really accurate, like a

[12:56] microplane that you can make like a fine grating of the botographer over the over there. You like patoga? I do. Both like the mullet and the tuney, like in both. I don't know the difference. Right? Right, mullet and tuna are the two, right? That they do? I know it's mullet, and I think the other one is two. I think it is. I don't buy it anymore, but the price, look, when I was like 15, 16 years ago, I could go to the international grocery on 40th Street, buy it for, like, I don't know, I could buy like a whole row sack. It can't be tuna because it's so small. But I buy like a whole rose sack for like, uh, I want to say like 20 bucks or something like that. You know what I mean? And it's like so expensive now. It's just so damned expensive. It's like a 100, it's like over $100 a pound that stuff. It's crazy. I like it though. Uh, so then you got uh, some cool thing, cool things like a code, they open, they open. They had that frozen foie gras where they froze the lobe and then they microplane the frozen foie gras over the top of stuff. That's a good use. You got your Faran, Adria, did his cauliflower couscous with a microplane where he grates just the tips of the florets off and they look like couscous.

[13:59] People seem to enjoy that. I never done it. Wiley used to microplane. He used to take gelan and set it like gelan, you know, the hydrocolate. He would gel at really high percentages, like 3%, which by the way, if you're not a hydrocoloid head, freaking unheard of, like

[14:13] dance, dance. Dance, dance. But he used to then grate it like Batarga. He would like make different flavors of this, like, I don't know if he still does it, but it's a technique he used for quite a while. Also, frozen meats or fish. If you want like a little bit of that flavor over, you want to incorporate it in, you can just grate with a microplane. And America's test kitchen recommends using it to get the burn off of cookies, if you burn a little bit of the cookies to grate it off. And, you know, you could try that on. I guess you could try it on like bread and toast. Don't you hate it when you get a little bit of the. I just use this sharp. I just like flat scrape blade my knife across the top of toast when it gets burnt. You ever do that? You try to save it and then you give yourself that piece. You give everyone else the good piece and you get yours looks all stupid and scraped with the little chatter marks because you chatter when you scrape the thing across it and you feel like a

[14:56] D bag for wasting the bread, but you didn't buy enough extra, so you can't just like throw it away or feed it to the dog or something. happens all the time, right? hate that. And as usual, the microplane can be used for its intended purpose, woodworking.

[15:08] And just a great growth stars out. Microplanes, they sell them for personal use, and by that it means shaving the dead skin off the bottom of your feet. There's a guy at 54 Eldridge, which is where our lab is, and we call the man coconut

[15:22] feet because he sits outside with a freaking paring knife and carves the calluses off of his

[15:28] feet and it looks like shavings of coconut on the side of the street, right? We never learned his actual name. We just call him coconut foot, right? And the wind picks up. Oh, Jesus. Now you're killing me. Now you're killing me. Let's see. Okay. Travis Hawkins wrote in on the Twitter. Love the crap you give, Nastasia for her friends, tomatoes in the fridge. Yeah, nice, right? Nice. massage is like, great, here comes more punishment. No, no, no punishment for you. Could you do a show on other common kitchen? I thought you said kitchen football? I thought you said refrigerator faux pas. Yeah, we could probably do a whole show on kitchen faux pas, but I was just thinking you made refrigerator. Don't put, like, don't go to get mozzarella. I'll just do some refrigerator stuff for you. Don't go to, uh, don't go to the, you know, buy your fresh mozzarella and then put it in the fridge unless you really are an enemy of quality. Like, do you don't put fresh mozz oil in the fridge? you? No, because you're going to eat it that day anyway. I mean, and you can leave it out the whole damn day. It's going to change a little bit, but the texture is better. I'd rather have it take on a little bit of a tang, then have it get its texture ruined by being in the fridge. Now, theoretically, if you let that giant ball of mozzarella temper out all the way through to room temperature, it

[16:36] will, they say get back to where it was, but I don't believe it. I've done side by side taste tests, and the refrigerator just ruins it. So don't put that there. Actually, um, if you, okay, now here's where Nastasia's like, daddy, daddy, mom, man, if you happen to have a, a wine cooler or a place of that temperature, I store usually all of my cheese that way instead of storing it in the

[16:57] fridge because it's much faster, and I hate it when someone takes a nice piece of cheese, and they leave it in the fridge, and they forget to pull it out, you know you're going to forget to pull it out. Like, if you're me, like, I'll pull that crap out hours beforehand. like, like, at lunchtime. If I know I have nice cheese and it's been in the fridge. I'm like, I'm going to pull that sucker out like around lunchtime so that like right before dinner and when we want to eat the. Are you before cheese before dinner cheese or after dinner cheese? Really? I, when I'm out, when I, like when I'm home, I like dinner, I did cheese beforehand. When I'm out, I really like a cheese plate at the end of the meal. And

[17:28] also, I obviously like Stilton at the end of meal because that's when I want my port. I want my port at the end of the meal and port and still. Hey, look, I know it's tripe, but that is one of the that is one of the few straight up delicious food pairings in the world where food wine pairings. Like most food and wine pairings, people are like, no, that one is really actually good. Do you like Port and Stood? It's good. Walnuts? Port Stilton? Okay. Uh, so cheese. Avocados do not store them in the fridge until they're ripe. Once they're ripe, you may store them in the fridge, but do not put a freaking baseball hard avocado in the fridge. Nastache has a California girl can appreciate this. Well, you probably like swimming in avocados. Yeah, we had a huge tree. Yeah. You know, like, so you never had the situation happen like you do here where you're like, I need one tonight and they're all hard. And they're all, well, I don't buy, I don't shop in those fancy $5 avocado neighborhoods. Like, down by you? You got to go to styles, farmers. No, no, even those like you, they can be when they're out of season. Yeah, well, like, luckily, I live in a neighborhood that plows through avocados like the end of the world is coming, so there's a huge amount of competition for the consumers, avocado dollars in my neighborhood. And so I never pay more than, like, at tops,

[18:39] like at the worst of times, 250 for the Haas, you know, and sometimes much, much less, like ¢99 Anyway, whatever. Yeah, California people are like laughing. Like, they're free for me. I live in California or in Florida. You know what I mean? Whatever. You know, we have our advantages out here. Hey, you moved out here. You feel more like a New Yorker? Yeah, I know, I know. Right now, I don't know what our advantage is. Well, we don't have weather advantages. I mean, like, you know, just whatever. I've never I mean, I have lived in California, but I was too young to remember it. Coffee. Do not store coffee in the fridge. I don't mean the beverage. I mean, you know, the product. You're going to get condensation as it comes in and out of the fridge, or the freezer, and the water is going to do you damage. Don't do that. Do not, do not store bread in the fridge. holy crap. How many times have you seen people do this? Why would you put bread in the fridge? It's like, it's, it's, refrigeration is the,

[19:32] like, retrogradation of starch is vastly, vastly sped up by

[19:37] refrigeration. And I've said it before on the show a couple of times. So general rule of thumb is that freezing of bread, right? is, uh, you need to do it rapidly because just the just the amount of time that it stays in the unfrozen zone before it freezes in that horrible

[19:53] retrogradation, uh, like heavy zone right around refrigeration temperatures. The amount of time it spends there just as it's freezing and thawing out again is equivalent to roughly a full days of

[20:04] staling, sitting on your counter. So do not store breads unless they're so jacked with like, you know, emulsifiers and anti-staling agents like wonder bread that it doesn't really freaking matter. That doesn't really matter. I mean, that's more of like a miracle of chemistry than bread, right? Uh, Potatoes, do not store potatoes in the fridge unless you don't mind the fact that they're going to increase their sugar content.

[20:25] And so then if you're going to fry them or something like that, they'll get overly brown. If you don't care about that, do whatever you like. It's a waste of freaking space to store, you know, I don't know. I don't know which of you people out there have so much freaking space that you can just throw £5 bags of potatoes into your fridge without breaking a sweat, but if you're that person and you're not

[20:41] going to fry them and you're not worried about the extra sugar content and you're an enemy of quality, go ahead and do it. Many herbs should not be stored in the refrigerator if you're

[20:49] going to do long-term storage. I do this because, I don't know, because I'm a jerk, but you know, you get the herbs, you bring them home, you put them in a plastic bag, you throw them in the thing, and

[20:57] 2 days later, what happens? They get that weird glossy, gross look. They smell like a swamp and you've got tissue damage where they get all waterlogged. You know what I'm talking about, stars, right? Better to do what Nastasia does at 54 Eldridge, which is she puts a glass of water and she sticks the herb into it and it sits there for, you know, a bazillion years. Now, she has the unfortunate habit of then never using the freaking herb and... Yeah, well, kudos to that. That's actually a good instinct. Uh, onion. I don't like storing onions in the in the fridge. I'm just worried it's going to transfer. I don't know, I just don't do it. I don't know that it's actually bad, although some people say it is. never had a nightmare happen and people have stored onions in my fridge, but I don't do it. Um, here's a reverse foat paw. stuff you should store in your fridge, but maybe don't. Apples, store your apples in the fridge. As soon as you get apples, home, store them in the fridge. If you pick apples, store them in the fridge. Apples, when they're at room temperature, they're respiring. Do I hate that word? I kind of like it respire. They're, uh, and what's happening is, is they're um, losing malic acid. right? Uh, and uh, and changing and ripening on the thing. So, like, if you, if you want to, you know, have it go, if you want to lose your texture, if you want it to go overripe on you, if you want to lose the acid and

[22:16] very few cooks want to lose acid in an apple, then by all means,

[22:21] uh, you know, don't put it in the fridge. But if you want it, if you want to keep those flavors, it's like we had those ash leaves, kernels in, those really expensive apples, and they got left out of the

[22:29] walk in because someone's like, oh, you don't need to refrigerate those apples because they're not going to go bad. And in fact, we took, you know, a lot of money in a very fancy

[22:37] apple and in short order, we erased a lot of its awesome characteristics because it went from being kind of at

[22:43] peak with its good acid content to being lower in acid than I liked and a little overripe. And as you know, like apples when they get overripe, they get a little bit floral, they end up

[22:53] tasting, not necessarily in a good way, but more like a Fuji. You know how Fujis have that kind of floral sugary taste. They tend to go in that kind of direction. And of course they get mealier, which doesn't matter to me because I'm going to juice the hell out of them anyway, but it's amazing to me how otherwise trained food professionals can't taste around the texture of an apple.

[23:10] It's inherently bad. Citrus. Citrus, you can keep it outside of the fridge, but the quality of it stays better if it's in the fridge. Now, if you have cases of lime sitting around, it's not reasonable to put them in the fridge, fine. But if you have a very expensive, uh, you know, setsuma or something like this and you want to maintain its quality, uh, I would keep it in the fridge just to maintain its quality. Grapefruit, especially I think she needs to be refrigerated to maintain its quality, otherwise the flavor starts to go. At least I've read about it. I don't have as much, and sweet corn, especially older styles, sweet corns that aren't like have like all the super sweet jeans in them, the colder they are, the better they'll keep their sweetness. The best thing to do is not store the suckers at all. to buy those suckers and cook them right away. That's the best thing, right? So I was like, I don't care. Okay. right. Should we take a break? Yeah. Let's go to commercial break. Come right back with the cooking issues.

[24:07] Wide Oak Pastors is the only farm in the United States that has its own USDA inspected red meat

[24:20] abattoir, or slaughterhouse, and its own USDA inspected poultry abattoir,

[24:26] a slaughterhouse. We partner with Whole Foods, to deliver our high quality meat and poultry, all the way to Princeton, New

[24:35] Jersey. One family, one farm, 5 generations, 145 years, a full circle return to sustainable

[24:43] land stewardship, a humane animal stockmanship. For more information, please visit our website, White Oakpastures.com. Oh, yeah, I love the way it says abattoir. Abattoir. Speaking of abattoir, the, what do you like? Do you like slaughterhouse better or you like abattoir? Slaughterhouse. Really? I love these. one of the things I like about style. She's like, give me the blunt stuff. blunt. You know what I mean? Like, much better to go blunt. And speaking of blunt, there was on Sunday, a, I don't

[25:24] know, it's a piece, what is it? not an opinion piece, it's just an article in the New York Times, about a slaughterhouse in San

[25:33] Francisco, and her 1st name just went out of my head. Nyman, one of the owners of Nyman Ranch. Christoph? No, no, no. This is like a blog. No, no, anyway, I'll figure it out. Anyway, she wrote an article on it because the slaughterhouse that they use was affected and there was a recall on all the meat that was slaughtered in 2013 at this slaughterhouse in the Bay Area.

[25:56] And because there was some, there was some unsound cows that had been slaughtered in that place. And so the USD response was to initiate a facility wide recall. Even though, right, that the cows that Nyman

[26:12] Ranch had slaughtered there, are, you know, were totally fine and were under a lot of scrutiny. And she was saying how ineffective our legislation is at dealing with situations like this. So I'm not going to get into the details of it, but I encourage you to go to the New York Times. I think it was on Sunday and look it up and check out kind of what's going on with regulations and the way that it's harming

[26:37] small scale producers who are trying to do the right thing by producing humane, sustainable meat. Color, you're on the air. Yeah, Dave, Dan, Seattle. Couple of questions. Both related to ramen. First of all, are you familiar with Yuzu Kashu, the Japanese citrus pepper paste? Yes, I mean, I don't use it much myself, but yeah, I'm familiar with it. Okay. I've just, I've gone crazy for the stuff and I'm using a ton of it. And I mostly use it. I mostly sous vide pork with it,

[27:12] which if you have never tried that, I recommend it. But the stuff is crushingly expensive in the quantities that I'm using it in. And when you cook the heck out of it for 24, 36 hours, I'm thinking that some subtly gets lost anyway. Do you off the top of your head have an idea about how to go about faking this from orange juice rind and whatever? Well, that's the thing. Yuzu has a very particular flavor and it, you know, uh, it has to do with, uh, the, you know, not just the fruit itself, but the oils that are in the rind,

[27:44] right? So there are other citruses that are available and on the west coast. I mean, there are people who produce Yuzu commercially, and it would probably be, I mean, it's still fantastically expensive. At the last time we bought some, I forget what it was some unconscionable amount of money, like a couple dollars per fruit or something like that.

[28:04] But, um, it's definitely that would be a cheaper way, but I, I've never found, I found other citrus, like weird citrus. Gene Lester is a, you know, a collector of citrus in California and

[28:17] Watsonville. And, you know, Nastasia and Harold McGee and I went over to his ranch and we tasted a bunch of stuff and they, um, he had some citrus that

[28:25] like, that like was, he had Yuzu, which was delicious. He had bergamot, which was great, but he also had like weird citrus that I've never had

[28:32] before that had some of these like strange oils in them that would make a good substitute, but I can't think of anything offhand. I am sure, though, that this is one of those things that hopefully one of our listeners will tweet on in

[28:46] something, some recommendation that they have to to get it done. Um, But, you know, it might be cheaper. Like, how much do they charge for it? It's 2 or $3 an ounce in the in the 3 ounce things that they'll sell little jars that they'll sell it to you in? And it's a blend of yuzu, Tokurashi, and then I'm salt. Yeah. I mean, I'm sure you could fake it. You know what? We'll figure out how to fake. I'm sure if you can find a supply of the Yuzu. It might actually be cheaper just to make it, you know? because they're definitely upselling you on it. You know where they make it? Do they make it stateside or are they shipping in? I believe the stuff I'm buying is from Japan. I mean, you can't find an English letter on the box, aren't we? Yeah, so you're, you mean, look, you're just getting ruined by like everything there. Like the cost of producing Yuzu over there, like how crappy our dollar is versus the yen in terms of buying power over there and the shipping. You're just getting it every which way on that. So if you could find like a California producer of Yuzu, uh, you know, I'm sure that there's someone that that ships the fruit up there, you could probably adjust the flavor to however you want. You know what I mean? And you could probably come in way under the line on that. I just never done it. So I, you know, I hesitate to give you any recommendations right off the bat. You know what I mean? So, but you think it would be a lot, if I can figure out where to buy an entire case of Yuzu, it would, you think it would be quite a bit cheaper? Oh, a case of Yuzu is going to set you back. One time, I forget some Japanese chef was doing Star Chefs, and Nils and I, he ordered 2 uses, he ordered, he ordered 2 yuzu, and they gave him 2 cases instead, and Nils and I just took that thing, and we made clarified,

[30:25] like, fresh clarified yuzu, and did carbonated cocktails with it. But, I mean, I'm pretty sure we blasted through a couple $100 a Yuzu in that on that day. I mean, you're going to you're still probably going to be buying them by the by the piece. I don't know they, I don't know you're going to want to invest in a caseload yet, but, you know, like, look, out here, you can buy, uh, Yuzu buy the piece for a couple bucks apiece at, um, at some of the

[30:49] Japanese uh, markets. The Japanese markets will have, you know, even ones that just do prepared foods that

[30:54] serve that sell any kind of Japanese products for cooking away. Usually you'll have one or 2 sitting around. Maybe if you're lucky, some Sudachi to mess around with, which are also expensive and delicious. All right, thank you very much. That's certainly enough to start on on that one. Related question. I'm trying to figure out fresh ramen noodles. Um, and I've got a couple of decent recipes for, I mean, the actual, you know, how much, uh,

[31:22] how much flour, how much lime water, how much gluten, got a yada? Right. But I've got a brand new meat grinder that comes with the larger whole disk is about the right size. Do you have an opinion whether the pressure is to push dough through that would just blow the thing apart? Yeah, I am I am very skeptical that that will work just because I've never seen anyone do pasta in the

[31:53] meat grinder, and I know that the pasta extruder attachment for the KitchenAids doesn't really do much of anything at all.

[32:01] I've had that unfortunate experience, yes. Yeah, I know, it's no, it's no good. I mean, every, you know, everyone wishes we had the, you know, what the ideas

[32:10] and food guys have, which is that Arco Bellino or similar extruder. Um, what's the hydration on the ramen noodle recipe that you have? I would have to look it up, but it's fairly high. I mean, there's quite a bit of water in it. Yeah, and my, my, my brain is erased now. Is it, is it steam or boiled before fry or fry and then steam? I always forget, and then dry. I think it's I think it's quick steamer or boil, then fry, then dry, I think. My brain is totally erased on this though. Well, the recipe I have, which is actually off an excellent blog called Tessa's Japanese kitchen or something close to

[32:50] that. Right. Um, She makes the noodles fresh and just boils, but I mean, I mean, I don't think that is itself a mild

[32:58] simplification of the full deal. Yeah, you need a fry step. Well, I guess maybe not. Like, if you're going to make it fresh, What am I talking about? Like, I guess not. Like, but you know, the commercial one, they're, like, the ramen noodle that, you know, we grow up with, they're fried to expel the water and get a little grease in so that they absorb a lot of the water from whatever they're placed in.

[33:16] You know what I mean? So they have a fry step involved with it. But, you know, perhaps, you know, this is something I would, I would defer to someone with actual, uh, cultural experience as opposed to, you know, just, you know, an American's experience of what ramen is

[33:31] like. Um, So I don't know, maybe that's the case. Maybe a fry step is not required. But I know commercially that's what's done. I'm just not sure how much that's preservation and whatnot. But, um, all right, so, but, regardless, the meat grinder thing is unlikely to work. Hey, look, I don't think you're going to ruin the meat grinder. I just think it's not going to work. Okay, so you think it would just not make noodles. Yeah, well, what are you attaching the meat grinder to? What kind is it, is it standalone with a big, powerful motor? Yeah, it's a standalone half. Okay, I've, I had one KitchenAid. Tack on meat grinder, it lasted like 4 or 5 years. It was great. I mean, it wasn't great, but it was perfectly adequate. It finally died. I literally wore the bearings out of the bushings out in it. Yeah, well, when I, but, oh, calm down again. But then the new one, um, cracked in a month. They changed it cheap into something. So I bought a Cabella's half horsepower. And, um, I

[34:33] mean, if it bogs down. I mean here's my here's my thing. If the motor starts bogging down and heating up, then obviously I'd hold back on it. But I think you're going to be all right. You know, it's all right to test it. I't think you're going to shatter it. as long as the gear's in it. assuming it's geared down, which it has to be. Otherwise, it would go crazy. Assuming the gears are of some sort of metal, and you don't crush it hard fast. You know what I mean? Like you, you kind of sneak up on it a little bit. I think you're going to be all right. I mean, most of the time when, you know, gears breaking mechanisms like that, it's because of a hard stop, you know? All right, so you don't. It's not likely, but you don't think it will result in metal parts flying across the road. I do not think it will. I mean, I won't hold you to that. All right, very, and you're gonna obviously want to, um, you're gonna need some method to space it that allows you to remove the, uh, the cutting blade. From the inside of the grinder. Yeah, I mean, I, I can surely find something to stick, I mean. Yeah, or double, you could double plate it. No, because it'll rotate. I think I can just use stainless steel washers. Yeah, all right. Yeah. you know, you don't want the blade in there because obviously that's going to be hacking the stuff right when you want it to be whole.

[35:51] thank you very much All righty. good luck with it Alrighty. We have a question in from Lucas. Lucas. We still need to cook his meat. Yes, we need to cook his meat. Yeah. We most certainly need. We should do that soon. We just got a lot of stuff off our plate. We can do that soon. As soon as we as soon as we get the prototype approved for the seers all, it's going to be a load off my mind. I can start thinking about cooking again. You know what I mean? doing some real cooking. Hi, Natasha, Dave, Jack, Joe, and Evan now. As you know, I love the show, a longtime listener. I heard about Dave's restaurant quality espresso machine he bought from a from an Italian mobster while fighting rat infestation. True story, but what I don't think I mentioned is that the guy that I paid to take

[36:34] at home in my car was a guy who had just gotten out of Rikers for dealing crack and was setting up a food truck

[36:42] downtown. And I accidentally, he was like a weird guy. refused to refer to me as anything but white boy. And like the, and I don't know, I paid him 20 bucks to take it home because when you buy stuff at an auction, it's as

[36:54] his wear is, right? You don't get to choose, you know, you got to get that thing out of there right now. And I accidentally left the pump. you know, the actual, like, you know, the, um, it's a rotary vein pump that they use in espresso machines, real ones. And I left it in his freaking car. So I had to go out there to his house, which was craziness, craziness to get it. But, you know, he actually, he's a nice guy. I mean, look, I mean, other than the, other than the doing time for dealing crack. He seemed like a, and calling me white boy incessantly. Did you have to call him and say this is white boy? I left my. I literally did. Like, I forget, like, why I even had the guy's number or was able to find

[37:32] him. Like, because he, I don't know, he was like, you know, look up my food truck or whatever, like this, but, like, I was like, hey,

[37:38] remember white boy with the espresso machine? I was like, which is it's a, yeah, it's uncomfortable thing to have to refer to yourself as in the therapy,

[37:48] whatever anyway. Okay, well, fighting rat infestation. I recently bought a house outside of the village and suddenly found myself in need of

[37:56] making coffee. I drink exclusively espresso and wanted to follow in day steps and buy something used, possibly cheap. The question I have is most of the machines I saw are advertising 450 watts of power consumption. I assume this is during the heating process, not once it's just kept on standing alone. Basically, how much power does this thing need on a regular basis? And did you change the water tank to a smaller one? Do you keep it on all the time? Can you use it to can you use it to modify it, to operate it without access to water, you know, fresh water on

[38:28] tap? I would love to have it in the living or dining room rather than the kitchen. The 2nd completely unrelated question I want is to work on my Indian cooking. Where do you buy good quality spices in the city? I know of le what in Midtown, but this is already mixed spices and part of the fun of Indian cooking is mixing them

[38:44] yourself, kind of regards Lucas. Let's go in reverse over here. So for spices, I don't really have a source of like the super highest quality stuff. You know, I end up buying most of my spices at dual specialty shop on 1st Avenue

[38:57] and like around 6 or something like that or 7th. and Kalustians. And then there's another couple of spice shops that are right around Kalustians, you know, in the 20s on Lex. But, uh, You know, I love those stores and I, you know, I'm not saying anything negative about them, but sometimes they, you know, this stuff's been sitting around a

[39:14] lot and, you know, Piper and I used to joke around that everything has like the Kalustians smell, which is not, oh,

[39:19] it's not an insult. It's just like they got a lot of spices hanging around there and not all the product moves all the time. But if you're buying whole products there, a lot of times you can get really, you know,

[39:27] high quality stuff. And for instance, I know dual specialty sometimes has the acid fetida, the

[39:33] hang, in kind of these block chunks and I find, and you might, hey, microplane. There's another microplane thing, acifeta, the chunks of Hing, uh, when it's in that chunk form, even though I think they still have it mixed with

[39:44] fenigreek and all that crap. It's just much less accurate and better in that format. Now, on the coffee machines. Here is here is the thing. Uh, it uses a boatload of power. There, there, all of those, so you're looking at a 2 group or 3 group machine. You can get a single group espresso machine. Now, the newer ones are, you know, they're fantastically expensive, like the La Mart Soco single groups. The single group espresso machines, by and large, you can run those things off of 120

[40:14] volts single phase, and they're going to pull somewhere in the area of 1500 watts or something like that, right? So doable off of a normal plug. They think they want you to use a 20 amp plug off of 120, but it's not 100% necessary. Once you're in a 2 group or situation, or more, you're going to need, you're going to need 240. And I think maybe even some of the bigger ones might need 208, but I'm not sure. The one that I had, which is a dual group Ranchillio, required, you know, 220 slash, whatever, 240, regular, you know, regular power, not 3 phase or anything like this.

[40:47] Now, the, the thing is, you have to, the advantage of these large machines is that they have a much more stable temperature profile in the

[41:00] shot than a smaller machine. And the reason is that the way a traditional heat exchanger, commercial espresso machine, the way it regulates itself is by having a very, very large thermal mass.

[41:14] And so they dump a lot of heat into it and they radiate a lot of heat out of it. And so and that's the way the way it does it. And the bigger the ship, like the less it steers around with little changes, like pulling a shot here or there. So in an old style espresso machine, in other words, old style, meaning like a heat exchange, espresso machine, and not like some PID, dual boiler, blah, blah,

[41:37] blah, blah. Although I have to say, I've had shots out of some of those and I still think that I like the bigger machines end up being better. But if you were to taste the same barista, the same make of machine, the same everything, except for the barista was pulling one shot out of a single

[41:54] group and one shot out of a 2 group. Odds are the shot out of the 2 group is going to be more consistent and better. That's just the way it is. I don't think you get that much of an advantage if you're really only pulling one shot at a time out of a 3 group or more. I think that once you get up to a 2 group espresso machine, the stability, the temperature stability is just a lot better now, but it does throw a lot of heat out. In my experience from a 2 group from the 80s, which is what I was using, uh, I had around a 15 minute heat up time.

[42:25] Now everyone's going to disagree and says that it takes longer for it to get stable and all this, but whatever. Give yourself a half hour, put it on a timer, have it set to turn on a half hour before you get up in the

[42:34] morning and have it go on. And if you, you know, you shoot hot water through it, you can heat the heads up, you know, relatively quickly, you don't have to sit there and wait for everything to stabilize because you

[42:43] can pump water through it. Now, I'm about to discourage you from having it in your living room and here's

[42:49] why. It's messy. So you need a knock box and you have those grinds everywhere. You're gonna want a source of water to wipe down the grinds and to get all that stuff out and to rinse out the, uh, to rinse out

[43:02] your, your, um, the porta filter, uh, and all this other stuff. So, you know, unless you can run a small amount of water near the machine,

[43:11] like I, I always want it near the sink so I can, you know, rinse the parts when they're done. I can scrub underneath with a scotch bright when it's done. It's just much more convenient to have it in a kitchen setting. And having that sucker plumbed into the water supply through a filter is

[43:27] life-changingly awesome. Now, you can get around that, you can take, and you could install fundamentally what's like a water cooler with a gravity feed into a pump, you know, or from a corny keg into the rotary vein pump that those machines use, and you can run it off a gravity feed with filtered water in, you know, in a living room, but then you have to figure out a way to get rid of the wastewater as

[43:49] well, because every time you pull a shot, when the, uh, when the three-way, the solenoid kicks in, you're shooting a little bit of water

[43:55] out, every time you clean it, you're shooting water out. When you're putting the blind in to clean it, do all that stuff, you're shooting water out. So it tends to dump a bunch of water, and you need someplace for that to go. And so you either have some sort of a, like an improvised larger drip tray, or you have it plumbed into, so wherever your dishwasher goes in, I have a separate takeoff where my dishwasher goes in.

[44:16] I have a condensate pump that sits on the floor of my kitchen underneath the sink. The espresso machine gravity feeds into the condensate pump, and then the

[44:24] conitate pump pops it through a check valve so I don't get backsplashing into the drain line right next to where my washing machine drains into the tap.

[44:32] And that's how I do it. That's what I'd recommend. I don't know technically because it's been a long time, so I couldn't, I now have one that runs on 120 because I don't have, you know, I don't have 220 in

[44:42] my in my apartment. So I couldn't throw an ammeter across my old guy, but they do suck power at the get go. I don't know what their steady state usages, but once they're heated up, they don't use as much, you can, you can feel when it clicks in and

[44:56] when it doesn't, you can see there's a pressure stat and the way that the espresso, those espresso machines work is, is that they, they come on

[45:02] when uh, the pressure stat shows that the boiler pressure is drop below a certain specified pressure. Anyways, so good luck with that. Is that right? Yeah, they have like five. What time is it? 49. 49. I got like 6 minutes. So I got, I got, I got 10, but you're going to give me 5 because you know I'm going to go for 10 anyway. 55 afterwards? No, Jeebus. All right, so I'm going to have to go fast. Hi. Nastasia, Dave, Jack, and Joe. I asked the questions a couple weeks back about the off taste in Agar. I went back to telephone brand. Flavor gone. Good. Using the same juice. I was using uh, uh, molecule, the brand. He, he wrote our molecule, but literally the brand is molecule R. Get it? Molecular, mullet mop, brand before because they sold in bulk. I tasted the agar alone and it's nasty stuff. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction. Actually, the same brand my mom used when I was a kid. Go figure. Hey, telephone, generation to generation, telephone's the best. Call up your friends. Use a telephone. You know what? Like, I don't even like, do you like, do you like that package? Like, I'm so used to that package. Everyone likes it. Oh, I love it. I like telephone. I just like the, I like, you know, it's more expensive, I guess, than buying it in bulk, but

[46:16] whatever. telephone. Anyways, I have a few questions about pectinex and adding body to low alcohol drinks. As a brewer. I've been using a generic powdered pectic enzyme from the homebrew store. Is there any benefit to using Pectinex Ultra SPL or are all Pectinaces created equal? No, they are not. Uh, Thomas. This is Thomas from San Francisco. They are not created equal. So, The one you're using in brewing is probably optimized fine for whatever it's

[46:45] for there. But the the, the enzyme that I use, the ultra SPL, is very broad-based. It's not a single enzyme, in other words. What they are is they're a group of enzymes that are produced by a particular strain of, I believe, aspergillis that the good folks at Novozyme have isolated, that produces a rather

[47:06] nonspecific broad range, pectinase and hemicellulase and some, not much, cellulase activity. So it's much more of a like an enzymatic baseball bat to use the SPL. So when I called up Nova Zymes years ago when I was trying to figure out kind of what enzymes to use, because we've been using something called Pectinex Smash, XXL, which is optimized for Apple industry to increase the yield out of Apple

[47:34] pomice when they're pressing to get juice. Uh, and optimized for that. And she literally, she said to me, look, you know, if you're only going to use one enzyme, just use the

[47:44] SPL. That does everything that anything else is going to do. It's just like, it just, it just takes care of it all. It's not optimized for any one industry. And so perhaps it's possibly more expensive on a per liter basis, but you're not using that much of it. non-industrial, and it works on everything. So they use that in like olives to increase yield out of olives. They use that in, you could use it in apples. I use in apples all the time. It's just really broad range stuff. And so, no, they're not all, same with amylaces. Like a lot of people, uh, you know, use amylase to break things down, uh, and they're not all the same either. Uh, you know, just talk to the folks who convert uh, potatoes into into vodka without doing, you know, using any sort of mash and stuff. It's all just with the right choice of enzymes to get, you know, as complete conversion as humanly possible. Okay. Secondly, do you have any recommendations for ways to add body to low alcohol by volume drinks, i.e. back sweetening citers,

[48:40] et cetera. I'm looking for something with high body effects, but low sweetening. So far, I've been using beet sugar with good results, but wanted to see if you had any thoughts on the subject. Thanks for all the work you do, Thomas, from San Francisco. Okay, so the, uh, the issue here is that, um, the issue is that if you're adding sugar, you can use sugar, but it's going to make it sweeter, you want it less

[49:00] sweet. Also, if you're going to store something for a long time that has live yeast it, obviously the sugar is going to ferment. And so, you know, a lot of times people want to add for bodying for sweetness now, for sweetness in body. They add a non-fermentable sugar like Zylatol. Too much xylotol, and it runs through you like, well, like crap through a tingos or it's crap through a goose. That's what Patton said, right? We're gonna run through them like crap through a goose. isn't that what he said? Something like that. Anyways. And oh, crap does run through geese. Man, I hate geese. Anyway, they're good. But the um, point is that uh, you want it non-sweet. So what you're going to want to do, I think, is find something like glucose syrup. Now, glucose syrup is actually, it has some glucose in it, which is sweet, but it's also got a lot of dextrins in it, things like, you know,

[49:44] like higher order polysaccharides that are roughly tasteless, but add a lot of body. And as a side benefit, they're not very fermentable. So a lot of times when I want to make something very dense, like a

[49:54] liquid very dense without using, without making it sweet, I'll put in glucose syrup. Uh, and you look, you want like a very low DE, the dextrose equivalent on the glucose syrup, because that means that, you know, very little of it's been converted all the way to glucose, and you have a lot of,

[50:09] uh, you know, larger chain polysaccharides that are going to add a lot of body, but aren't going to add any sweetness at all.

[50:15] Glucose syrup is, you know, very dully sweet, very, very dully sweet. And you can buy it at, you know, pastry supply houses.

[50:21] Okay, uh, now, uh, Tony, you asked me a question about soda and cocktails. I don't know if I'm going to have time to get to it. Uh, so I'm going to get you next time, uh, and I'll get you some more information about value. Tony from Brazil, our friend from Brazil, wrote in to ask about carbonated cocktails on tap, and it's going to take me too long to go into the rant on carbonated cocktails to deal with here.

[50:42] Moustache is like shuddering just thinking about it. So put it on next week's topic and we'll talk about it. But Sam, I've missed you 2 weeks in a

[50:52] row, and I thought I was going to be able to get Mark Ladner on to discuss it, but I couldn't make it work. So I'm going to just read your question. give you some brief thoughts right now. What's the best approach for homemade pasta sheets in lasagna bolognese? How do you like that? Bolognese. Say it with me, sis. Come on. All right. Marcello Hazan has you pre-blanch and rinse the pasta beforehand to combat. Sogginess. Is this necessary? Compared to classic pasta dough recipe of one-ish cups of flour for about one egg. How do other pasta does compare, like Keller's 12 egg yolk pasta, or I've read 7, or gluten dough pasta found in modern cuisine at home? Thanks, Sam. Here's the deal. Yeah, you want to pre-cook that to form the structure. I should say I've never done it without cooking it, but I've always cooked lasagna before I've, you know, fresh lasagna before I've put it into, into, because you want the protein to set and you want to have it bind and coagulate so that it doesn't get all,

[51:46] all, I'm trying to think of a non, uh, a word I can use with that. non-cursing word. Anyway, shit yeah. You know what I mean? Like, you want it to be, okay. okay. So, but I don't know that for a fact. That's a question, like, maybe Stas can just ask Mark and report back next week. But the thing on egg yolks versus eggs, I did a lot of research on this one, and there's some interesting articles on it. So if you look on the internet, most people will tell you that aside from the flavor and the color that

[52:12] you that you get in egg yolk. So a lot of people say that if you do eight, I've always, by the way, this is just, you know, for me, just so you know where I'm coming from. I was always a whole egg guy. I never, I never did egg yolks, uh, and I never did egg whites. I always use hold eggs, always. And I would typically use one egg for every cup of flour, and then I would add enough water to get the hydration where I wanted. That's just what I've always done, you know, since since I've started, you know, making pasta in my 20s. So the uh, but it's a very interesting thing. Now, if you look on the internet, a lot of people who are, you know, cooking, you know, practically

[52:46] cooking will tell you that the, um, the egg yolk one is harder, right? And like, you know, harder to need and chewier and stuff like this. But I think they're making a fundamental uh mental error and that is this. Egg yolk is, has much less water in it than an egg white does. Like the water content of an egg yolk is only like somewhere close

[53:09] to, you know, the solids are high. The solids are in the 50% range, when you include the fats and proteins and everything like that, there's not nearly as much water in an egg yolk as there is in an egg white.

[53:20] So in a study of, um, in a study that you can go

[53:26] read, I'm trying to get it to you before, uh, they rip the microphone off of me. If you go to, uh, modeling a fresh egg pasta characteristics for egg content and albumen to yolk ratio by, uh, Christina, alampreci, uh, from this was in the Journal of Food Engineering in

[53:46] 2009, and another good, uh, uh, getting the name of it for you. Uh, for cooking of it is the influence of hydrothermal treatment on realological and cooking characteristics of fresh egg pasta by

[54:00] a uh, nuviari. But if you go to that 1st egg one, They say that actually, if you adjust for the amount of water that's in the egg product that you're doing, that adding egg increases the structure of the

[54:14] dove, something like fresh pasta because you're increasing the protein content. And in fact, the protein content, the most important one of them is from the white, is the ovalbumen. And that's what's forming the structure that's causing it to be firmer and have that firmer feeling of an egg pasta. Now, the homemade rather egg pasta, right? So if you account for the water, the more egg yolk that you add,

[54:36] right? The less firm it is, and the less firm it is when it's cooked, the softer it

[54:43] is and the radically higher the fat content is. My feeling is, is that, is that people who say it's harder are making a lower hydration dough than they would normally make by using egg yolks and taking advantage of the plasticizing effect and the lubricating effect of the fat

[54:58] in the egg yolk and it's allowing them to make what they can, uh, uh, a more workable dough that is firmer because it's going to have a fundamentally lower moisture content. And that's my feeling, but I'm going to try to do a little more research on it and get back to

[55:10] it on next week or maybe if we can get Mark. And on the way out, we had a final call in, we actually someone sent us this on the Twitter beforehand,

[55:20] but Don't tell them why, just tell them to call it. All right. Oh, yeah. I'm not going to tell you, but I'm not going to tell you why to do this, all right? But Damon Cisco wants you to call. Where's the numbers, Daz? Do you have it on the thing? The number got erased off my phone. Oh, no. I have it. hold on. All right. St is going to tell you to dial this number. It's not, it's not unpleasant. It's not it's not pornographic. charge you any money. It doesn't cost any money. Nastasia is about to read you a telephone number. And when she reads it, I want you to write this number down and then I want you to call it. 719-266-2837. One more time. 719-266-2837. Have a good week, cooking issues.

[56:06] Cooking your shoes. Thanks for listening to this program on heritageradionetwork.org. You can find all of our archived programs on our website or as podcasts in the iTunes

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