[0:00] Today's program is brought to you by Whole Foods Market for more information. Visit Whole Foods market.com. I'm Laura Stanley, host of Inside School Food. You are listening to Heritage Radio Network broadcasting live from Bushwick, Brooklyn. If you like this program, visit Heritage Radio Network.org for thousands more.

[0:23] Hello and welcome to Cooking Issues. This is Dave Arnold, your host of cooking issues coming to you live almost at 12 on the Heritage Radio Network from Roberta's Pizzeria in Bushwick. Brooklyn. Joined, as usual, with Nastasia, the Hammer Lopez. How you doing? Good. Yeah, we got Jack Jackie molecules in the engineering booth. What's up? We got ice cream sandwiches on the way. sandwiches, sandwiches. We also, I think David's over there. Did somebody say sandwiches? Yes. Well, we also have, we also have Peter, Peter, the Kim, Kim Master, Kim Wipe, the Captain

[1:00] Kim, from the Museum of Food and Drink here for all of your food and drink. What's a Kimwipe? Kimwipe is the laboratory version of Kimball and Clark Kleenexes that are used in laboratory environments.

[1:12] Kim White. And Peter Kim just crossed the line as usual, habitual line stepper, and made an obscene gesture in front of the fellow

[1:21] who, luckily, is texting eating his pizza. Oh, man. Is there anything more depressing than a dude chugging a glass of red wine by himself with a pizza texting?

[1:29] It's like if you're just having a glass of red wine and the pizza. Maybe if it were like 7 o'clock, it'd be a little more for you. It's noon on a Tuesday. It sounds like a Billy Joel song. You should rewrite that. It's not 5 o'clock on a Saturday. What was it? I'm texting alone. Peter's using his flamenco skills, but many of you might not know because Nastasia, while she loves to share other people's personal information on the radio

[1:58] program, doesn't share her own. It was her birthday yesterday. No, it was Two days ago? Sunday, Sunday. Same. Anyway. So Booker. Oh, so you don't want this stuff? That's from Booker, not from you. You don't want the stuff I got you? Okay. Yeah, yeah. Oh, oh. So Booker Booker wanted to get her sour patch kiss when she is. And then Dax wanted on the action, so... And then, you know, Nastasi and I, our favorite shopping area, is the as scene on TV section of the local CVS or, well,

[2:28] Nastasi goes to CVS because it has close proximity to her. I go to a Rite Aid because, you know, that mentioned this already, the new Rite Aid, the Rite Aid, they've gone, their buyers aren't local. I didn't buy the story. But the, they're like, the, there's an entire section of garden tools in the, in the lower Manhattan, like lower

[2:49] east side, Rite Aid. There's a whole section of garden tools and like hose accessories for your pocket hose. Don't get me started. There's like a, there's like a, it's called a hose holder. Like, yeah, yes, clibbitual line stamp, Peter. But I was like, who the hell's gonna, like, we're not in fancy parts of Manhattan, like Nastasia, who's part of a community garden. Ain't nobody needing hose, hose implements, like actual garden hose implements down in my neighborhood. But I saw something that actually I've always wanted to buy because it horrifies me. But I can't buy it for my own use. So I got it for Nastasia. And we'll talk about it. Oh my god. Yeah, yeah, tell him what it is, does. It's a dump meal cookbook. It's the dump meal cookbook. I have got, I have purchased Nastasia, the dump meal cookbook. And luckily, luckily, folks, in that same section, because I know that Nastasia Lopez does not have a crock pot.

[3:37] H on a second. Oh no. Oh, wow. A New York apartment sized. Proctor Silex test improving. Rite Aid bought. Crock pot. Perfect for 2 for you and Mark Stas. So, like, I want you, like, well, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, you know, I think that like, and we'll see what the people in the chat room think. but so the idea of dump meal, dump, dump meal. What's the lady's name who wrote dump meals? Kathy Mitchell. Kathy Mitchell, author of Dump Meal, also had the other cookbook, Dump Cakes, Dump. We gotta get her on the show. Yeah, so my point is, is that like, it's kind of a horrifying concept. By like 3 cans of this and like a hunk of that, throw it in a

[4:21] crock pot, walk away, and then when you get home from work, you have a meal, right? I'm gonna try it. So anyway, so I think that people might enjoy Nastasia highlighting a recipe maybe like once a week or something, making it, like actually trying to eat it in Stasia Lopez down, and

[4:35] they come and breaking down the dump meal for us. I mean, maybe, look, maybe, in fact, I know this lady is making more money than

[4:41] we're ever going to make on anything that we do with the dump meals and, you know, like, so why are we worried around like, oh, like, we're all worried about little nuances of flavor and production and stuff. It's like, no, don't. Have you had an idea as good as dump meals? No, no. No, apparently I have not. Apparently, I have not. The dump meal. So maybe you can look through here while we're talking. Yeah, but no, you won't because you hate cumin. Two bean chili. I thought when you give a number like that has to be an odd number. She has a 2 bean chili in there? Come on, there's no such thing as a two bean chili. 357, you know, or something. Yeah, do an odd number. Yeah, how many beans in the salad? It's never like a... It's a bean salad. No, 4 bean? No. Odd number of beans. This is like Peter. The same with beans and grains. Really grains as well? Yeah, multigrain bread. You have 11 grain, 13 grain, 9 grain, never like 6 grain. It's true actually. Yeah, that's true. You know, but sometimes, in other words, like, if you only had 2 grains in it, you just wouldn't call it out. No, you would multigrain, maybe. Right. No one has like duo grain. So here's one, spicy orange chicken nuggets. You put it on the crock pot. Frozen popcorn chicken bites. Oh, teriyaki marinade. Three quarts, three-fourth cup, orange juice concentrate, some orange marmalade,

[6:00] sriracha, and orange peel. Orange peel? Why are you going all fancy on me? All of a sudden, now you're... We have a few things happening here. There was an ice cream sandwich delivery that just happened. And I also have Don Lee on the phone. Oh, all right. Well, take some Don Lee while we're getting the ice cream ready. All right, Don Lee, you were on the air. How's it going Dave? Going all right. Going a little better now. Nastasi is cooking up something in the dump in the in the dump pot. We call it the crop. Well, speaking of bad business plans, I've got a business proposition for you that is worse than your deli belly plan. Oh, have I ever spoken about deli belly on air? Is anyone remember whether I was spoken about Dolly Belly dinner? Okay, okay. For those of you don't know, the idea is we go to places where there might be stuff in the local water that gives you severe gastrointestinal distress.

[6:48] We ship the water here to your locale and serve it to you in the comfort of your own home so that you can, you know, wrangle out your issues with your own toilet and your own doctor and then go travel with

[6:57] impunity. That, the deli belly. horrible, horrible, terrible idea. All right, go. So we take this to the next logical conclusion. Why get sick? Why not just have a fecal transplant? Oh, super poop. Super poop. Well, have you read Mary Roach's excellent book, Gulp? Yep. Yeah. So in there, she discusses Mary Roach. excellent author, by the way. her books are phenomenal. She a very funny writer. on science topics. Discusses poop transplants, and that fits in Peter quite well with your farm to toilet kind of thinking for the museum. But you really, so you actually want to make a business of this? Don't you still need to get people sick before you? I think you need to take one for the team. Go everywhere, drink all the tap water everywhere and create the ideal flora fauna in your

[7:49] system, and then market your poop as the super poop. Wow, that is so hardcore. Like, that might be the grossest thing we've ever discussed. Yep. Do we have a do we have a bell for the grossest thing you ever discussed on? I don't think I have a bell for that. I don't know Like a gross bell? I'm like. I just have this. Is there such a thing, Jack? Is there such a thing, Jack, as a sad cowbell? A sad cowbell? I don't know. I'm trying to imagine what a sad cowbell is. Let's see. see if I can do it. It's still too, yeah. Still too, like, it needs to be, like, muted somehow. Yeah. We'll work on it. We'll work on the sad cowboy for you. Yeah, that's even sadder, right? That fits super poop. That's what you would say. more like a bowel movement, yeah. All right. All right, Don. You got anything else for us? Otherwise I got to go eat some ice cream sandwiches. I just want to do a quick rant to say that I'm really mad at all this native advertising I'm

[8:51] seeing. I just found out that Hellman's Mayo has trademarked the term

[8:55] Strange Witch and is getting celebrities to talk about weird sandwiches. What? Hashtag StrangeWitch. Wait, what? First of all, what the hell is a strange witch? Any sandwich that's odd? Apparently. Do you put mayonnaise? Do you put mayonnaise on a Cuban sandwich? I didn't know that that was a thing. And then I heard some people were like, no, you got to put mayonnaise on a Cuban. What are your thoughts, guys? Mayonnaise on a Cuban? Nope. I don't know. No? I like I like mayonnaise quite a bit. I, I, I, from time to time, will purchase the Helmins, which is known as best foods mayonnaise for those of you who are west of the

[9:35] Rockies. I think it's just west of the Rockies. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know what I think about that. I don't think sandwiches should be strange. I think sandwiches should be delicious. It's my feeling Let's start on Twitter first. You'll see a lot of advertising. Most recently, Patrick Harris just posing something, I think, love that guy, but why is he shielding relevance? I don't know. I like Neil Patrick Harris as well, so I'm going to assume he just likes the product. I will, I will do some research, Don, on Neil Patrick Harris's sandwiching, uh, sandwiching stuff, but in my mind, uh, Doogie Hauser can do no wrong. I mean from Doogie Hauser to Starship Troopers. You guys are Neil Patrick. No, you want to hear the strange witch he made? All right. Hellman's, Peppers, garlic time, allspice, and coconut. First of all, what kind of peppers? Well, 1st of all, what kind of peppers? Does it matter? And what kind of coconut? What are we talking here? I can't think of any combination of those things. Unsweetened desiccated coconut. It's kind of like a neutral thing. I mean, think about it, you use that all the time in savory, right? So what do we got here? What kind of peppers? don't know. also worse than that. It's not bread. It's on toastones. Oh, yeah, it's a bad idea. Yeah. That's not a good idea. I mean, who knows, maybe it tastes good. Not a sandwich. Tostone is not as Tostone is not sandwiched sized. It's a cracker sized. Peter, do you consider something between 2 pieces of cracker a sandwich? You don't want to get me started on this, but no. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I don't I don't either. I don't either. Man, no. So are we adding leaven into the sandwiched? Oh, that's very strong. What are your feelings on? Do you require leavening for a sandwich? I think there's a continuum and I would say leavening puts it in a more sewer camp of being a sandwich. Right. So in other words, there's a gray area. You say, you got to take into account the

[11:25] bread of suffering of affliction. Matza. Yeah, but they didn't have time to make a sandwich. They're running through the desert trying to escape. They didn't have time to make a sandwich. They didn't have time to make bread. to put some meat between 2 matzza, to carry it, so it's easy to eat in the desert while running from the Egyptians. You deny them there. They had to bake the bread within like 10 minutes of the water hitting the flour. They're not going to have time to sit there and slice the pickles and put on the mayonnaise and all that other stuff.

[11:54] You know what I mean? I think you're like you're out, you know, you're supposed to be, if it's affliction, the sandwich is like a height of delicious, right? So like, if it's supposed to be affliction, what the hell you doing? You can't, no, no, I mean, no, no. My point of view, I like cream cheese on a matzo, though. If you have unleavened bread, but it's, but the shape of the way you're structuring this thing is actually a sandwich, like a slice of unleavened

[12:15] bread and then stuff that you would normally put in a sandwich and then a slice of unleavened bread on top, that could qualify as a sandwich. However, the other, but if it's wrapped around it, then I think you're starting to move into more like burrito. But here's another thing. Here's nothing you're going to add, right? Like whether or not something is technically a sandwich is kind of moot. By the way, we need to get these ice cream sandwiches are going to go. But the point is, is that there are sandwiches that maybe are sandwiches, but they

[12:36] suck. And here's why. A sandwich, you should be able to pick it up because remember open face sandwiches or what? Not sandwiches. Because they're literally not sandwiched. They are a layered, they're, they're, it's topped. It's like, I don't know. Point is, is that you should be able to lift a sandwich in the air and take a bite out of it without the, without it shattering into a 1000000000 pieces and raining down onto your lap. So matza doesn't qualify. Mata is like a big piece of shatter. It just, you crush it and it shatters. I would have to agree. Yeah, it's not right. Matza, peanut butter, delicious. Peanut butter and jelly, on a matza, delicious, not a sandwich. Matzo pizza, not pizza. Delicious, not a sandwich, even if you snap it in half. You know what I'm saying? Anyway. That's my feeling. All right, all right, all right. All right. So we have some, uh, we have some ice cream sandwiches here from, uh,

[13:26] milk cult, milk cult, DC, which are, we've been following them on Twitter for a long time. I've never actually met them, I don't think. I was actually going to be in DC on Friday. I was gonna maybe stop, but I'm not. This is a Ziploc bag, Nastasi. I think someone pilfered some of the sandwiches. These are was sent to the show because we did a session where... So let's see how many you can eat. All right. Yeah, now go. All right. Oh, my God. I didn't realize I was going to go into, I was young, by the way. My wife doesn't allow me to do that stuff anymore. Vanilla chocolate chip. Now, Jack informs me that in the trip, and I can see they were slightly melted and remelted, I would say there was like a 35%

[14:10] melted happening, you know? 35% meltage? Yeah. And then we, you know, threw them in the freezer, so... Oh, so there, yeah, yeah. The wax paper. A little bit. Not like all the way, you know? Peter's always got to hate. Peter, you know, Peter is like a big ball of... That's like, yeah, Peter, we told that story on the air, right? We were at somebody's, where were we? We were in somebody's like favorite restaurant. We were somebody's fully in town in Williamstown. Somebody's favorite. I'm eating, so Nastasi explained this. And some professors took us out to their favorite restaurant. They asked Peter what he thought of the food and Peter said, undercooked and overseasoned, overcooked and underseasoned. Oh. So people get see what it looks like. No, thanks, Dave. I don't want any ice cream sandwiches. Thanks, man. Good. glad you don't. What do you got? That's a thing of ice cream. I guess you cover something. It's hard to talk while you're eating an ice cream sandwich. And sassy, you're going to have to talk for me. what you're taking out of here. I took out a tub of vanilla ice cream, and now I'm trying to separate other sandwiches. It's coconut to fear. Oh. I don't want to spoil my appetite. What? Really? You were mailing an ice cream sandwich from Freaking Washington. You were going to eat it. Yeah, plater, what flavor do you have? I don't know what I don't know what flavor this is. And Nastasia said that. She's got the best one. At least melted one. The one that was closest to the ice pack. Vanilla. No. I see vanilla beans, but it could be vanilla bean matter, of course, right? Why don't you explain that little bit of nanny poo to the audience while I'm finishing my

[15:47] sandwich? No, I mean, a lot this Dave actually loves telling this story. It's really your story to tell, Dave, honestly, but apparently in a lot of vanilla ice cream. Pretend you're to even see. I was at a factory. Hello, this is Dave Otto wrong cooking is too. I don't want to tell you about my story out loud. Vanilla bean, meta and vanilla ice cream. So it turns out that, so it turns out that a lot of the little black specks you see in vanilla ice cream are not really, they don't serve any flavor purpose. They're just, this stuff called vanilla bean matter, which is just this byproduct from processing vanilla that has 0 flavor, but it just has the

[16:22] little brown specks of vanilla bean in it, and you can put it in ice cream to make it look like it has more vanilla in it.

[16:30] And apparently Dave went to a flavor house. Was it? Yeah. Yeah, in fact. And I don't know whether we want to call them out, but they're one of the people who helped us on the exhibit.

[16:41] Well, yeah. Oh, now he's eating a sandwich. No, I'm supposed to be talking. And so, like, I went and took a big spoonful of this stuff out of the, out of the barrel, and it basically just tastes like kind of like a little bit like a tea, like a little bit mildly vegetal.

[16:55] Nastasi even, this has nothing to do with anything. I've already plowed through one sandwich, by the way. So that's how long it takes me to finish one. I keep going, so if I have to talk, I'll eat another one during break, uh, and then we'll talk about it. But, uh, Nastasia, you would follow me this. It kind of food related, this lemonade thing. Jack has, Jack has, you know, being a musical style person is definitely following it. I mean, wait, this is coconut? No, not the one you have in your hand? No, that one. would rather eat that. No, what? I would rather eat. The bucket? All right, jeez. Do you have a spoon that? We can make that happen. We're so demanding. We're so demanding. By the way, one more note on the dump meals before we go. can't take this lady anywhere. There it goes. One more note on the dump meals. This woman, what's her name again? Do you remember? Kathy Mitchell has slow cooker recipes for pork tenderloin in it. It's all. You see how hammered that? Well, I think part 101 is what I ate at that restaurant. Well, that's your fault for ordering it, fool. But, like, the thing is, is, like, I think at the end of a slow cooking, a whole pork loin, right, in the cooker, I think what you do is dump the sauce off, eat the sauce, and then use the pork loin as a

[18:07] Brillo pad to scour out your slow cooker because that's about how usable it's going to be at the end of that. I use it as a pumice stone. Yeah. Oh my god. My thing didn't modify. I don't have today's radio questions. I'm going to have to do it. I'm gonna have to do it by, do you have the questions? They're just the one. No, there's two. Oh, the one I send this one? What did you have about lemonade, Dave? Did you have something there or just? No, I just wanted to know what you guys thought about. I know Nastasia follows Beyonce and Jay-Z and, you know. Yes, Stas, you're into that? No. That's a lie. That's a lie. Like on Instagram, I do not. Oh, no, I mean, in real life, you follow him. Like, you're like... Yeah. And then, yeah, whatever. I had an issue because somebody, I heard somebody the other day was like, yeah, Beyonce is like the new

[18:55] prince and I'm like, yeah, after she, maybe if she learned how to play 10 instruments. Wow. I mean, come on. Yeah, this is the 1st episode we had after Prince. I couldn't believe that happened. Crazy. What's your favorite print song, Jack? Whoa, that's tough question. I've been listening to a lot of more stay in the time for the past week, actually. Oh, yeah. What's the song? 777-9311. I don't know if you know that one. That's good stuff. I'm a fan of a housequake. You know that song? Yeah, that's good. I like Housequake, and I like the black album, because I remember back when in the 80s when I was in high school, we

[19:28] went, and I think it was the 80s. Yeah. We went down to St. Mark's place. There used to be a place that sold bootleg cassettes on St. Mark's and bootleg actually LPs. Oh, right. And we was only available bootleg, right? I don't even remember the name of it. It's like it was upstairs. You know what I mean? We would walk up the stairs to that, like, 2nd Florey shop and

[19:45] it's all these bootlegs and we were like, you know, kids, you're like, 0 my god, it's illegal. Why is nobody busting these people? And you buy bootlegs. And Prince had a whole, and at the time, this blew my freaking mind, right? Prince had a whole album, the black album, which he just never released. He did it. He finished it, compiled it, never released. I think he later did actually. I think later it was officially released. Yeah, it did. female like a few years later. Yeah, but like back then it was like the idea that like someone would compose a whole album and then just be like, nah, crap on it. And then not release it was like, like, and so there's a song in there called Bob George that I listen to a lot. Bam, bam, bam, bam, bam, bam. It's all this crazy. You know that song? No. Bob. I think Prince single-handedly triggered my entry into puberty with

[20:28] the song Cream. Whoa. That's way a lot of information while you're sitting there pounding ice cream sandwiches and making lewd

[20:37] gestures. That's lewd gestures. Before, he Before, he totally made a lewd gesture. There's no l gesture. That's a lew gesture. No, it's not a gesture. It's a total new gesture. Every day I have to deal with this people. Please. This man runs a food museum. Can you believe it? All right. Hey, cooking issues, gang. Good luck on the centrifuge. By the way, we have the what they hopefully last prototype rotor before we can like figure out and approve what's going on. So it should be some updates soon. That's coming what, next week? Next week. I can start testing with it. Oh, I do not envy any of you that have to make items across intercontinental item manufacturing

[21:16] is, oh, such a joy, right? Stas? Yeah. Good luck on the centerfuge. I have my ducats ready to slap on the pre-order form. So my grocery store, so now that here comes the question. So my grocery store only sells cream in pints. And at the rate I go through it, I tend to only use half before it spoils.

[21:35] Any tip on how to keep cream fresher for longer or fresh for longer. I primarily use it for seasoning coffee, I guess lightning coffee. I would guess I would use about a quarter of a pint a week maximum. So I need a pint of cream to last a month with quarter pint drawdowns. I've tried the room temperature stable mini have in halves, but the flavor is overly cooked

[21:55] caramelly and not what I am going for. That's just gross. Stuff straight gross. Gnarly. Nasty. Fresh sweet cream flavor is the best. If there's nothing to be done, any recipe suggestions to use up the cream before it spoils every week or two. Thanks to the great content. Chris. Oh, Chris, Chris, listen. Listen, 1st of all, uh, cream, at least in my supermarket, cream is

[22:18] actually, uh, vastly more expensive in the um, pint and half pint uh, things and vastly cheaper in the full court. So it's like, you're paying only, like if you're buying like a half pint to a quart, you're only paying double for the whole quart versus a half pint.

[22:38] Now once you have a quart of cream on hand, right? Then you can use some for your coffee and then you can do all kinds of fantastic stuff with the rest. Butter, right? Making your own butter is fant- it's delicious. It's rewarding, and you get the buttermilk for cooking with pancakes or whatever, muffins or whatever. I't know what you cook. Do you cook pancakes? Do you cook muffins, any kind of baked good, right? The butter is delicious as butter, right? I don't bake with that butter, but that butter is great on bread and stuff like that. you have a kitchen, it's pretty easy to make. You've got to remember when you're doing it, um, you want to uh, coat the, um, you want to coat the, put plastic wrap around the bowl so that you, um, put plastic wrap around the bowl because it's going to spatter,

[23:20] right, as it goes and use the, um, use

[23:24] the, uh, the cake mixing thing and not the balloon. The balloon is going to become a kind of a thing, don't I use that? Maybe I use it blue. I think I use the cake because I think the balloon gets all nasty when the butter breaks and when it breaks and turns into a big ball.

[23:36] Anyway, maybe I can't remember. It's been a while. Try both. They should both work. Do it chill that way. Another thing to do is whipped cream. Hello? Whipped cream is so freaking delicious. Who doesn't like whipped cream? Stas, you like it? Yeah. She's like, yeah, what am I? I'm not I'm not Satan. I know some people don't like whipped cream on things. Here's some things of whipped cream. Like whipped cream on ice cream, good. People say, oh, no, it's like, it's like cream on cream. Yeah, good. You know what I mean? Whipped cream on cake, good, whipped cream on. I don't put whipped cream on my breakfast items. Oh, like pancakes? I don't. Yeah. It's not bad. I just don't do it I like whipped cream on cookies though. At nighttime. I like whipped cream on donuts at nighttime. Not in the morning. I like whipped cream on a spoon. I like whipped cream, basically. Dave Arnold's new children's book. In any format. Now listen, listen, listen, people, listen, if you're

[24:34] gonna make whipped cream at home, the easiest way to do it is like spike it with some sugar, that's

[24:38] gonna make it stay stable longer and put it in the EC canister under pressurization, and it lasts a long time in the EC thing, if you have a whipped cream siphon. And that's the easiest way to keep whipped cream around so it doesn't spoil. You don't have to re whip it all the time because if you whip it and put it in a bowl. It doesn't last very long. Now, another thing, there are many different kinds of cream. You should look at the cream you're purchasing, okay? So the, uh, there, The best tasting cream by far is just regular pasteurized cream, but it's actually increasingly

[25:10] difficult. I mean, like, well, I'm sure on pasteurized cream is the best, right? But of the stuff that you can normally buy, standard pasteurized cream

[25:16] is, um, the is the best tasting. But at least in the court variety, which is the way that I buy stuff all the time. You can't really get it because it doesn't last as long. Back, you know, if you work food service, you can get that kind and you go through it so it doesn't spoil. But when you're buying, and I forgot, I didn't look at the small containers, but if you buy the

[25:36] quart sizes of cream, fresh cream. They're high temperature pasteurized. Like, they're like ultra high temperature pasturized cream, and they should last a month. I looked it up. My Dropbox didn't update, so it didn't come through, but I think that those things will last a month, but now you have to go through a whole court in a month instead of

[25:54] just, what do you say, half pint or something like that? Yeah. Uh, keep it in the back of your of your fridge and it should go on. Now here's another thing. Uh, you should start using cream in uh, soups. That is delicious. Yeah, that's good. Cream soups. And then people could be like, you're cooking with so much cream. be like, shut up. You're eating a whole thing of broccoli. It's a little cream in it. suck it up, right or wrong. Totally. totally right. And then here's another fact. So there's a lot of argumentation, argumentation, argument. There's a lot of argument. See, I hate that. It's like I don't like the word utilize either. It's like a bunch of extra syllables. You know what a good way to say utilize this? Use, use, use. Anyway. Jack, what are your feelings on that? you have any feelings? On the used utilized debate? Yeah, he'll go with you. You go use. Yeah. Like Miley Carpenter, who runs the Food Network magazine and is like, you know, the editor in the family, other than my wife who edits my books, obviously. My book, uh, is, uh, the whole family

[26:49] hates, uh, the word utilized because it's just, it's, it has no use. The word utilized has no use over the word use. Unless is there some, is there some sort of like, unless you literally mean, I am taking something that was not a tool and turning it into a tool.

[27:07] And technically, it has been... Yeah, that is a good use for the word. When does that come up? I'm utilizing my knowledge. No, you're using it. Anyway. Yeah, that was a tool. tool. No, no, no. How would you use it in tool? I wouldn't. I mean, what would mean? Utilize a stick? I use a tool. I use a stick to beat you over the head. Boom. Beyonce uses a baseball bat to smash up that car. See, they didn't utilize a baseball bat. weak. Week. Another one. anyway, I'm not going to get later on, we can go into magazine editors,

[27:40] uh, grammatical uh, pet peeves, because they're kind of interesting. Using 2 from and things that aren't arranged, hates that. Hates that. They have everything from chickens to French fries. And you're like, excuse me, not a range. Like, what continuum has chicken on one side and French fries on the other. It makes no freaking sense. Yeah, they don't have everything anyway. voice, of course. Well, that's how, you know, anyway. So stay away from those sorts of stay away from those sorts of statements. Why are we getting into this? What we talking about? Now, cream. We're talking about whipped cream. The problem with cream is, is that cream that you buy in the store, aside from whether how it's pasteurized, typically heavy cream, they know you're not going to use it very

[28:21] long, and they know you're going to use it for a lot of different things. They stabilize typically the hell out of it. So look at the box of cream on the side. And the stabilizers they use in the cream. will radically change whether or not, and here's the important thing for you in particular for what you're doing. Whether or not the cream is 100% free sauce stable. So cream, as it comes out of, well, after it separates, but cream, as is given by the cow, right? If you freeze it and then thaw it, the ice crystals, and so Harold McGee has a very good section on this on food and cooking, where the as it freezes, the butterfat will form kind of sharp butterfat crystals, the ice will water will form ice

[29:04] crystals. These will mess with the fat globules. What are your thoughts on the word globby? Hate, hate, globulo. The labule, the spurs. Right? Glabules and spores. There's like Nastasia, like, this is like her skin is creeping. If you want Nastasia to have nightmares. Send her pictures of like leaf fungi. Oh, don't do that. Yeah. Well, I'm not saying that viewers here, listeners don't want you to have nightmares. They're not going to do that to you. Do it, do it. Do you also have a whole phobia? There's, you know, people who like can't look at like lotus roots, for example, because like the grid of holes. You have that problem? Really? Is it ever since you hit that pothole in Brooklyn? like tripe, for example, also things that are. Yeah, the problem with Swiss cheese? The problem with, ooh, Swiss cheese? No, it's Swiss, so you like it. That's so true. Swiss cheese is a little better. Yeah? Yeah. Because it's more like a crater. Yeah. Because you can see the bottom of the hole. Itchy. Makes you itchy? Yeah, that's the thing. People have this whole phobia, they get all itchy when they see all these holes. This is a real thing? Yeah, I guess so. I heard it for it? I'm going to look it up. Let's see Where the hell does that come from? Does it come from watching too much? I don't know, shy of the blood. pronunciation here. Yeah, tripophobia. Tripophobia? Like you're gonna trip into the TRYP. Oh, phobia. Oh, really? Could be tripe. don't know My problem my problem with tripe is is like, it's delicious, but that smell is so indicative of like slaughterhouse smell. You know what I mean? Anyway, until you totally process it. whatever. Back to cream. By the way, I love that we're talking about cream after I said cream, you know,

[30:45] prints. Get on top, cream. Yeah, yeah. Boogie bop. Yeah. Peter always has to take it inappropriate place. as a family-free can show. how many times I have to say this. Hey Peter. I got something for you that you'll appreciate coming up in a 2nd here. All right, Jose. All right, so cream. So listen. So what happens when you freeze cream that hasn't been treated. Oh, yes. Yes, yes, yes. Sorry, you can keep talking, Dave. I love it. I love it. We are more scattered than even normal. on today's show. Dave is now the Dizza. Oh, you're the worst. That way you can't get sued. Oh, is that the amount you can do without getting sued? Yeah. That's what I just said. don't know. See, he has made that up. You don't know if we're going to get seen. All right. I just started cranking into it. Anyway, whatever. I was gonna try to explain cream at that point. But look. So if you don't add any stabilizers or whatnot, the as I said, the butterfat will form little thingamajugers that ruin the fat

[31:49] globules and the ice crystals will do the same because they're sharp. And you can read about this, McGee's on food and cooking. And when you thaw the cream back out, probably won't break, but it won't have a lot of the same properties.

[32:03] I don't know about the whipping. I never tested, but I know that that kind of cream is not going to be as heat stable as it was before, so you're going to get a lot of fat separation, right? Um, by the way, uh, well, I'll finish before. But the, um, but luckily,

[32:19] unluckily for some people, luckily probably for you, most creams that you buy, again, I haven't looked at the small containers, but the large containers, the quartz, are heavily stabilized, right?

[32:29] So I looked up 2 different ones on the web. I looked up or I don't have it in front of me, but so do it from memory, organic, horizon brand.

[32:37] There's is stabilized with geland gum, right? And so what Jeland gum does is, is they're probably forming a very light, um, a very light fluid gel with it to keep

[32:47] it uh, stabilized, but I'm, I haven't tested that one for free sauce stability, but, um, that might

[32:54] increase the freestyle stability. It depends a lot, depends on which geland they're using and like, and what ratio they're using, because they don't say what kind of geland they're using, whether they're using high acyl, low high or low acyl geland. But then I looked at Lando Lakes, Lando Lakes, cream, and Lando Lakes, cream has a shotgun spray, stuff in it to stabilize it. So, it's got polysorbate 80, which is an emulsifier.

[33:17] It's got mono and diglycerides, which is another multiplier monitor glycerides. I used to use it more. I haven't used it in a long time. It's, uh, so yeah, triglyceride is a fat, right? So it's a, you know, it's got 3 fatty acids on a glycerin thing. And if you break, and it's obviously it's lipophilic. it likes oil because that is a fat. It's an oil. If you break off, one of those fatty acids, right? Now you have a little bit of a water loving portion on where the fatty acid was attached to the

[33:44] backbone, and that would be a diaglas ride. break off 2 fatty acids and you have 2 of those water liking areas. And so you get this, what's called amphophilic, molecule, monodiglyceride that can do some emulsifying. It is very heavily balanced in the favor of fat, though. So you have to dissolve monoondiglycerides and fat. And you could do all sorts of fun stuff with it like thickened fats or make fat foams or all kinds of other things. But anyway, so it's got monoondiglycerides in it, which is going to increase, it's probably going to increase its whipping ability, the cream, probably going to help it on the freeze thaw.

[34:13] Um, I don't know if the polysorbate 80 is helping on the freestyle or not. I'm assuming it is. It's another emulsifier. I don't really know as much about the functionality of poly sorbet 80. because I've never used it as a standalone ingredient. Uh, but lastly, and not leastly, it has uh, Carraginen in it, and Carraginen, uh, you know, in these levels,

[34:32] like, it performs a stabilization, um, similar to what Jeland's performing in the other thing. Long story short is with that, poop spray of stabilizers in it. I bet you you can freeze and thaw that land o lakes cream, uh, and use it without without issue. The issue, without issue, and then I say there's an issue. The problem is it takes a long time typically to thaw these things out. You want to exclude error. So it depends on how your freezer works. But like a lot of times, even with liquids, I'll put liquids in freezer

[35:03] zippies, and then I'll get the air out with the zippy, and I'll throw the zippies in because they freeze very quickly. And it's, have you noticed Stas recently that, um, some ziplocs are crappy? I just noticed this recently, like, no, no, on, honest to God, Ziplocs, I've had a couple

[35:21] side seals go bad on me. Remember, were those brand ziplocs that time that we did the, uh, the, um, blender drinks with the, uh, and remember we got, oh, they

[35:32] weren't. they were off brand. where they, I've been having problems is that the double steel on the top, you turn it on the side and it forms a little spout and it pours a little bit of liquid out of that top.

[35:43] So always invert your ziplocs after you seal them to make sure that you don't have a good seal. Anyway, exclude the air. Ziploc, label, they freeze quickly that way, and they thaw very quickly that way. So you can just put it in cold water running in the sink and thaw it out in a couple of minutes because if you just take a quart of cream and put it in your fridge to try and thaw

[36:01] it, good freaking luck. You know what I mean? It going to take forever. Another thing I've noticed is that when you're thawing, um, when you're using, um, uh,

[36:10] milk, or I have this situation where I put milk that was already expired in a fridge, closed the fridge, went back a week

[36:17] later, and it was fine because the fridge hadn't opened or closed at all. So if you can keep your milk and dairy in the absolute coldest part of your fridge so that it's not going through a lot of temperature fluctuations, it will last a

[36:28] lot, lot, lot longer. That's another point. Um, I had another point on cream, but I don't know. Should we go to a break? Maybe I can think about it. Yeah, and then I got a question for Peter that he can mull over the break. Antoine wants to know if they have anything regarding sustainability at

[36:44] MoFat, and with that, we'll be right back. Not that soft.

[36:54] Today's program is proudly brought to you by Whole Foods Market, America's healthiest grocery store with more than 400 locations throughout the United States. Download the Whole Foods Market app on your smartphone for recipes, sales, information, and digital coupons, or visit Whole Foods Market.com to find a store closest to you.

[37:21] All right, before we come back on another thank you to Christopher Tompkins Tinch, who donated on behalf of cooking issues, there are a bunch more donations that came

[37:33] in, I got to go through the backlog, but really appreciate that, everybody. And we're back. All right, so Dave is right now racing to see how fast he can eat a ice cream sandwich. Anyway, so we had a question about MoFAD and sustainability, and yes, I mean, in short, sustainability is right at the heart of what we're trying to do at

[37:58] MoFAD. And I think the big challenge for us is that so far we've only been able to take on one exhibition at a

[38:04] time, and the 1st thing we did was the puffing gun exhibit, which traveled around and looked at the story of breakfast cereal, and the exhibition we have up now is on the flavor industry.

[38:14] And so we've really only been able, and the way we approach things is we like to do, take on really narrow stories and do a deep dive. And so we haven't had a chance yet to do an exhibition that looks at sustainability in a big way, but we've been taking it on in our

[38:27] programs. And so we've done programs. We did something with slow food, for example, where we looked at some endangered food species and highlighted them. And

[38:35] so yeah, I mean, that's stuff that's all incredibly important for us, and that's going to come up in

[38:40] exhibition very soon. Peter, you got so political there. I like it. Yeah, it was good. I mean, no, it's serious. It's really serious. No, Antoine. So Antoine Dave, and then maybe we could take this later, but Antoine elaborated and he's like, oh, can the

[38:52] Dave and the crew in the chat room comment on interesting innovations and sustainability for avoiding food waste,

[38:57] upcycling, and repurposing, like making shrubs out of spent fruit or produce? What do you mean shrub? Oh, shrubs. I'm like, plants? What are you talking about? Like, shrubs, like, like, uh, drinks. Yeah. Oh, speaking of shrubs. Another thing you can do with cream. Just came up with a recipe last week for stabilized cream syrup to use in cocktails like

[39:20] grasshoppers where it doesn't break no matter what you do to it. So you just add sugar to the cream. Not a full simple syrup. I got to get the ratios. I calculated it at the bar, but you sugar it. I think it was like 30% by weight or something. I gotta go look it up. And then you add a little acid to pre-break the milk proteins a little bit. It thickens quite a bit, but it is stable as the day is long in a drink and it's good. We're going to be putting that. cream issues. cream issues. Dave Arnold. creaming issues. Creaming is not a gross word. It's a technical freak and dairy term. Jerk. All right, offensive. Jerk. So how quickly do you eat that ice cream sandwich? So 1st of all, the question is, how how fast, how quickly can I eat a milk cult

[40:04] DC ice cream sandwich while still enjoying it and making fun of Peter while he's talking on the

[40:10] microphone? And the answer is 45 seconds. So I can I can eat one in 45 seconds, still enjoy it. So I'm not like pushing it into my face at the fastest rate possible and make fun of Peter while he's talking in 45 seconds. Very impressive. I mean, a shadow, a shadow of my former self. Shadow. Were you there at the French culinary hot dog eating contest? They had a hot dog eating contest. And, uh... And at the time, I was

[40:40] like, smaller even than I know. He did it in a Lucha Libre. Yeah, El Santo. Yeah. But I had to, I had like, like, like rocky style. I had to cut the mouth hole because the mouth hole wasn't big enough to shove the hot dogs in. So I had to cut the corners of the mouth hole. And like, all these big guys were like, yeah, whatever. I hosed them. I like just ripped them up. I went full Kobayashi. You know what I mean? The squeeze and dunk. Squeeze dunk breaks smash into face. I remember you telling me about in high school how you used to drink whole 2 liters of soda at the supermarket to

[41:12] build just hand the bottle back and get your deposit money. I'm cheap. How recently was that? I was in high school, man. I had no money. So like, you know, you were, I was at a summer program and like, you know, the, the $50 I had was the $50 I had. You know what I mean? And so like, you know, after, and I don't drink flat water, it's disgusting. I think I mentioned this. At the time I was drinking diet soda. So I didn't want to pay them their deposit. So I handed them the money. They took the deposit. I drank the entire 2 liter in front of them, put it back down onto the counter and got my money back. Wow. because that's how cheap I am. But I can't imagine you actually enjoyed the entire 2 liters. That's where you're wrong. I am the utility monster. I enjoy. I enjoy down to the bitter end. I told you, well, you weren't here. But they, you know, they, certain things, I've never like, I can't have another, like, I can have, I won't eat another ice cream sandwich now because it's, like, I'm older

[42:10] now and it's gross, and I've had 2 already, but, uh, It's not, I'm not, not eating the next one because I wouldn't enjoy it. You know what I mean? Thank you, by the way, to milk cult DC for the sandwiches. Nastasia has the ice cream ice cream. don't like it very much. Why? Because it tastes like lemongrass. Oh, and you hate... She hates lemongrass. Tastes like Asian. Well, for those of you that don't know, Peter Kim is of the Asian persuasion. like him. Also, I'm having a slight breakdown right now. What do you mean? Because I looked up tripophobia. And the 1st thing that comes up is just freaking photos and like inside right now. Oh my god, I can tell you're actually like scratching yourself. Oh, she is, she is, I'm not. She is scratching herself. Ooh, it's not a good Google search, I will say. Not doing well. Please don't send Nastasia Lopez. Oh my god, yeah. having a visible reaction to it. That's crazy. I mean it's a rough search. I don't know why you did that to yourself I wanted to see what remedies there were. And then, of course, the 1st thing was like, boom. Oh, well, so the remedy apparently is not total immersion. Yeah. Say, here's the remedy. Boom. All right, yikes. So, uh, we had this in from uh, John Vermilen, uh, about, Actually, we have an invite to go visit. He has a pasta factory. We didn't mention the name of it. I looked it up, but I'm not going to mention it, because he didn't mention it, maybe he doesn't want me to mention it. They're like, they do a lot of contract work. They make lots of funny shapes. They make like the little pizza, pizza wedge shapes. What are your thoughts on funny shaped pasta? I don't like it very much What about for kids, though? It's bad. It's bad. All regular pasta shapes are funny shapes, though. Like, what are your feelings on pre-stranglers? Stroats of bread. I like those. Do you like it because it contains the word strangle or do you actually like the texture? No, I like the texture. Yeah? But you think the funny shapes are not texturally involved. They're just they're just pictures. Yeah, and they usually break, you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, that's because people overcook them. You know what else I saw? Because they're selling to commercial establishments. One of the things they sell is heavy wall pasta for retort applications. And I was like, because we've had actually people wonder about like, you know, how to put pasta into soups and stuff here. And it's like, well, the pros, I guess, buy

[44:28] heavy walled pasta for retort applications. So we said, use like oars. Are you getting better? Yeah. You recovering? I think I'm tryptophobic now after looking at that stuff. That's bad. Nastasia? Yeah, no reaction too? Really? Nastasia is like like some sort of chipmunk like wiping her face off. As though there's a hole on her face that she can wipe off. Yeah, this is crazy. I've never seen such a reaction before. so gross to me and I can't move. I actually I actually feel bad for Nastasia now. And I never... 1st on the show. What about Ray? I actually yeah. Wow. As you know, it's bad if I feel bad. I've been catching up on some cooking issue shows. In the January 26 show, you mentioned a pest control fumigant. What about that word? Fine. You're like, with what I'm worried about in my head, too. Yeah. Um, if you may get used for food manufacturing facilities, it's now banned because of ozone concerns, you're probably thinking of

[45:27] methyl bromide. Yes, I am. Our pasta plant in Fairlawn, New Jersey, now uses profume when we fumigate, though it's unfortunately not as effective as methyl

[45:37] bromide. Our nemesis is typical, this is, remember, it was in a result because someone was trying to cure a bunch of hams in their

[45:42] house, and I was worried about mites for them. Uh, not as effective as methyl bromide. Our nemesis is typically the red flower beetle. I hate those mothers. You ever had, um, if you buy, have I discussed this before? If you buy certain kinds of like small run organic flowers or like specialty flowers, like chapati flour, a lot of

[46:02] times, the facilities aren't as like locked down as like the big milling concerns

[46:09] are. And so you can get, uh, like eggs from things like that, and then they will later get infested, which is why I freeze the hell out of all those flowers.

[46:17] You freeze those flowers, Peter? No, I never thought about that. I would. Yeah. Or like if you bring spices from another country, you should freeze those suckers. You know what I mean? If you're going to store them for a long period of time because who the hell knows what's going to pop out. you know, who knows? Maybe you could bring the next Asian longhorn beetle with you. No, don't do that. I wonder whether that's ever happened. Usually they come like pests like that come in on. I guess it has happened. Usually they come in on things like crates and whatnot. Anyway, because like spices aren't on the list of no brains, right? Well, yeah, but then anything brought in. Well, actually, it's interesting. Yeah, I guess not. Yeah. But stuff running commercially, it all gets... Our nemesis typically the red flower beetle and profume just doesn't kill the eggs very well, so you have to just increase all your other pest management work, which is the right thing to be doing anyway, of course.

[47:08] Hope this is helpful. Uh, fan of your work and great to see MoFan on such a rule. And this is, a side note, Peter Kim and I actually had a good chat about pasta and noodles or Italian American food history

[47:18] as a potential museum topic. Do you remember side conversation? Yes, of course, John. I had been emailing with them. I would like to go see his factor. Yeah, I told him we'd try to come out. He's in Philadelphia? No, Jersey. I don't know where Fairlawn is. It's in Jersey. All right. So a couple of updates. I fired, I, by the way, I told you last week, I think I told you that I brought this chicken gun into the city, but then wasn't allowed to fire it in the city, this chicken cannon that I

[47:43] built. I brought it out to back to Connecticut, took it back together, fired another chicken because Dax wanted to see it shoot. 250 mile an hour. I launched it into the forest. It hit a tree, hit the top of a tree, and was still going up when at the 300 foot mark when it hit that tree. crazy man. What's a chicken gun? We already went through. I'm not going to go through the game. I just, you know, thought I'd give people an update on it. Now, what was the question we had about sustainability and shrubs and whatnot? Oh, like repurposing old fruit? Is that what he said? Old fruit. Now you sound like an English dude. Old fruit? spent fruit and produce, you know. Yeah, food waste, upcycling, repurposing. Like, obviously, anyone at anyone who is paying a lot,

[48:29] like, in a commercial application, even at home, you should, but in a commercial application, especially, you see a lot of

[48:34] waste, and it bothers you, right? So you have certain things you just, you have too much of and there's never going to be enough use for it. Like, you know, we have so many lemon and lime and grapefruit peels

[48:47] that like, unless we literally opened another business making marmalades and weird things like that.

[48:53] It, not even the right stuff in marmalade, you'd have a tough time. But I always enjoy finding uses for things. I mean, it's kind of, you know, it's, it's a responsible. It's responsible to your restaurant or yourself because you throw away a lot of money and it's

[49:12] responsible. It respects the ingredient because you're getting the maximum amount of use out of it. And it's just responsible all the way around. And I think it's a really good mental exercise as well to try to reduce the amount of waste that you have. Now, there's various ways you can do this. One is to take all of the scraps and just cook something disgusting and force your employees to eat it. And that's the what, like, used to be like the old family meal style. Remember, uh, uh, Alex Guanachelli once told me that when she was working at, you know, some like 2 star or whatever to like 3 star Michelin, I don't know, in uh, France, what they would do is they would just collect up the raft from clarification, like all of

[49:50] the, like the spent lean ground meat and spent egg whites and like foam and gunk and just serve that up.

[49:58] Here's your family meal. Enjoy. Enjoy the raft. Stas would be like, crap on this. Like, imagine Styles, what would you do if they, like, you'd be like... I hate the raft. Really? Yeah? Wow. Hate the raft. Anyway, so like that's one way to reuse things is just shaftier, shaftier friends and family. Um, but there's a lot of like other, obviously, like certain things can be composted, any vegetable peelings can be used to make stocks, which can then be frozen on fruits. I mean, um, when we have leftover juice, we try to reuse it for cordials, when we have peels, it's a little harder. Like I made a batch of grapefruit bitters once out of a bunch of spent grapefruit peels and it was great, but I made a lifetime supply out of like one day's

[50:48] grapefruits. You know what I mean? So it's hard to figure out 100% use for all that because a lot of times you'll need a lot

[50:56] more, especially in a bar, right? So when you're ordering meat, It's much more responsible to design your menu such that you use up the right amount of each thing, but when you have a bar, it's hard to say, well, I'm going to have a bar

[51:10] now, and so you're going to have 35% peel-based things, right? So you're going to have, it's like, you know, half oleosacram, no,

[51:17] oleosacram is great, but we don't go through enough of it and people demand more fresh lemon juice drinks. And so I can't really, Oh, you know what? I probably could, if I had more cojones, I could probably figure it out, right? It's just a matter of not having the will or the cojones to do it. Right? Well, that's an interesting idea. It's hard. I think it's difficult in a bar with things like spent fruit. Luckily that stuff's typically not as expensive. And when I am using really expensive materials like strawberries or

[51:48] like there's a new drink on the menu that Felipe made with Nopales. Did you have that? Did you like that? Rum and Nopalis. It was good. Things like that, we typically get very, very high yields because we're using a centrifuge,

[51:57] so very little waste, which is one of the reasons I like the centrifuge, and which is why

[52:02] Anastasia and I are going to start selling more centrifuge. So Stas, do you have a recipe picked out that you're going to make for next week? I think I'm going to do the chili or I'll do this low cooked pork and sauerkraut. Okay, Nastasia's gonna come back with her dump meal version of slow cooked port and sauerkraut. Shout out to Milk Cult. Thanks, Peter Kim, for coming on to the radio program. We'll see you next. Oh, next week is Rangum. We got Rangum from Catching Fire, how Learning to Cook

[52:31] Made Us Human. I think that's the exact title of the book. We have to look it up. Call in your questions about how cooking made us human next week on to cooking issues.

[52:44] Thanks for listening to this program on heritageradionetwork.org. You can find all of our archived programs on our website or as podcasts in the iTunes

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[53:13] Thanks for listening.