[0:00] This episode is brought to you by Jewel, the emerging circulator for sous vide by chef steps. Order now at chefsteps.com slash J-O-U-L-E. I'm Damon Bolty, host of the Speakeasy. You're listening to Heritage Radio Network, broadcasting live from Bushwick, Brooklyn. If you like this program, visit heritageradionetwork.org for 1000s more.

[0:27] Hello and welcome to Cooking Issues. This is Dave Arnold, your host of cooking. on the Heritage Radio Network every Tuesday from, like, well, this time, like 1215, like, yeah, like one o'clock on the Heritage Radio Network from Roberta's Pizzeria,

[0:42] where, Peter? Brooklyn. Where in Brooklyn did? Oh, and Roberta's. Dude, what's the neighborhood in Brooklyn where we are? Bushwick. Well, as you can tell, joined by an ever peppy. Peter Kim, grand vizier of the Museum of Food and Drink, got Dave in the booth. How you doing? What up, doing good? All right, good. And we have Nastasia of the Hammer Lopez next to me. How you doing? Good. So calling your questions, museum related, perhaps or not. Uh, 2718-497-2128. That's 718-497-2128. Uh, so yesterday was the 1st day in the closing week festivities of

[1:29] uh, Booker and Dax, the bar. And uh, man. I think people had a good time, but man, was it a poop show. We like 86 everything like right away. Like they took the chairs out, so like the bar was 3 deep. Uh, and, uh, It turns out that, I don't know how to operate the PLS system. Like, all these drinks just, like, it was just like, uh, I think it was good, though. People had a good time. We had the 86 a bunch of stuff. Um, but uh, last night we had uh, D came back to, you know, our manager, D

[2:01] Canonas came back uh, as a guest bartender. We had, um, Ann Robinson came back. Jesse Vita came back. Austin Henley came back and told me an interesting story about, uh, you will enjoy this, Nastasia, about, um, Damon Bolty. I didn't guess I didn't, I knew it, but I didn't think about it. Teague, who's coming tonight, by the way. So if you come tonight, we have like Nick Bennett, Souther Teague,

[2:27] coming tonight to Booker Index. Who else? Dana Corey. I forget who I'm not. I'm not mentioning a couple of people. I got to look at Nastasio look at the list maybe if she feels like it. She doesn't. She doesn't. And tomorrow we have David Wondridge and uh, Leo Rovachek and uh, Don Lee coming uh, to the bar. So look out for that. But anyway, so Austin says to me, Austin says, so I was doing Damon

[2:56] Sho at Roberta's with Southern co-hosts, right? Yeah, so he's doing the show and, you know, Damon Bolty's identical twin, which you talk about a lot and stuff. You like that factor. Whenever you mention David Bolt, you mention the identical twinness. And there are too many freaking food and drink identical twins in the New York City area. There's just too many of them. It's crazy, right? I mean, like, in other words, I have not met an identical twin that doesn't have one of the twins working in the food

[3:21] business. Someone needs to do a study on this. Have you met any identical twins, Peter, that are not in the food business? Is it because we only know people in the food business? You know lawyer people. Nastasi, you know like weirdos, weird non-food people, right? Do you know any identical twins in that scenario? I know one. I think about it. know one. Medicine. And architecture. Not food. Anyway. So David Boldy's twin comes in and apparently everyone Roberta's like, hey, what's up? He totally ignores and pulls Anastasia, like sour face and blast, right past him? And then when Damon walks in, everyone's like, Damon, wow, you such a dirk man. He's like, that was my twin. That was a good story, right? Good times. Anyway, so, uh, also turns that, also turns out, went back to Booker Index. The jerks that live above Booker and Dax, like haven't lived there as long as the bar has existed and start complaining at like 11 and smashing things into the floor to tell us to be

[4:18] quiet. Now, I don't know about you, but you don't turn, blow the whistle down. You know what I mean? If you're playing blow the whistle or any one of those other songs and you're mixing drinks and your

[4:28] bar is 3 deep, the correct response is not, turn the music down, the correct response is, don't move to New York and live above a

[4:35] bar, more on. You know what I mean? Idiot. Who does that? Like, that's what I hate about New Yorkers. Like, not New York. real, like, you just wouldn't move, if, if, you, you are not entitled to change the people who already exist around you. You know what I mean? You move into a place. The place is bad because there is, uh, it's not

[4:56] like, it's not like all of a sudden. Okay, look, I've done this a bunch of times, right? I'll move into a place and the person who lived in my apartment before me is was like an 85 year old woman who lived alone and never had any visitors because her kids never came to visit her

[5:11] anymore. She made 0 noise her entire life. like, you know, I don't know, didn't watch TV, no cable, nothing, no noise, nothing. She dies, we move in with, like, the kids and me and, you know, the dinner parties, the family dinner and all this

[5:27] stuff, and everyone gets mad. And you know what? I kind of understand that, except for you live in New York. Like, you're not entitled. to your kind of super quiet privacy, nice life. That's why it's New York. Nastasi, what do you think about this? I think yeah. I mean, like, do you, I mean, like, there's bounds of rationality, but, like, living directly above a bar that you moved into. Did they move in after you were there? Yes. All right, well then... Yeah. Living in the city. trade-offs. Well, it's not a trade. like, just like, you know, understand what you're dealing with when you move in. You know what I mean? Like some people shouldn't live in the city. Like, apparently, these frat weasels who moved into this, like, I think there's like 30 of them living in this

[6:13] apartment, uh, going all against frat people. you know what I'm saying? 30 of them living in his place above us. And then, uh, I don't know, whatever. Just suck it up, you know that? whatever. So anyway, Peter, you're on here to push the museum of food and drink. The only reason why I ever come on. Was that? Yeah. So we need it in one day. Right. So we just need 2 cooking issues listeners to donate 5000 each. Yeah, and even beyond that, it's the last chance to get tickets to see the exhibition before it opens to the

[6:45] public. And so it's going on till 8 p.m. tomorrow, and we need to cross the finish line of $80,000 by tomorrow. Um, I'm super psyched by the exhibition. We're going to have, I mean, just a recap, we're going to have the fortune cookie machine. have tastings. We'll be demonstrating some different techniques in Chinese American cuisine. We'll have some awesome menus, giant wall, takeout boxes. Um, so yeah, it's gonna be like just, you know, awesome show. And so get your tickets on chow.mofed.org. And we're going to we're going to chain Peter or something. You can just pillory him. Like, that's going to be one of the things we will set up a dunk tank with Peter in it. Wouldn't that be awesome? Oh my god, Peter, you should totally do that. Like a Peter Kim dunk tank. You think we can make? How is that Chinese? I don't know. It has nothing to do with that. It's like part of the little side. If somebody puts in $10,000, I will set up a dunk tank. You heard anything. Will you get in it, Dave? Hell no. I will set up a... I'll get in. I'm sure I'll get... Family show. I said bleeping. Pretty soon, actually, we have the non-family show from Johnny Walker coming up. I've got to talk about this. By way, Nastasia, you'll enjoy this. The name, this Latin name for, you know, the beans with beans. You familiar with it? going to enjoy it. Physiolis vulgaris. like that? All right. Let me get to you some get to some questions if I wasn't smart enough to pull them up. Okay. Um, this is from Shy. It is well known that old beans take longer to cook. than young beans. Why is that? Well, I thought I knew the answer to this question. And it turns out that I don't know the answer to this question. You know, you think it's just kind of a moisture thing, but, um,

[8:27] that doesn't really, I don't think, explain

[8:31] what's going on. Then I did an initial search on the internets and like every manufacturer and like council that tries to sell dried beans will tell you if you store the beans too long, they

[8:47] say in quotes, they will never soften. Now, I know that's garbage because you can pressure the heck out of them and soften them. You can add baking soda and soften them. But then I realized I didn't understand. It's not simply that it's drying out. Something else is happening. So I have to, the short answer is I have to go, um, I have to go look it up. And, you know, I'll have to go do some sort of, you know, a scientific search on the order of, um, um, you know, dry beans,

[9:16] storage, ch- storage changes. Like, it's always like people who have the money for these sorts of studies are always kind of big industrial

[9:23] concerns. And so you always add things like storage, shelf life, dried

[9:27] beans. You try to phrase your searches. This is it, by the way, anyone who actually wants to find their own info, right? found out from Ariel Johnson, who was here a couple

[9:41] weeks ago, that there's a website, and I'm sure, you know, all of you guys, all you cool kids out

[9:46] there already know about it. But it's, and I don't know, like how legal slash illegal it is, but I'm going to give you guys this website in case you don't already

[9:57] have it. It's Psi, like science, SCI dash hub, H-U-B dot

[10:05] CC. Okay? That's SCI dash H-U-B dot cc. And um, this website allows you to download any, almost any scientific paper that is behind a normal, like university firewall.

[10:22] Now, it's not as easy to use as a, you know, university thing because you need a record called the DOI.

[10:30] Now, what a DOI, I don't actually know what it stands for, but it's a long, long identifier that uniquely identifies a particular

[10:41] article. Okay? So how do you get that? So many, many, many of the either the university search engines or even the actual database

[10:50] owners, like Wiley or El Sevier or these guys, will allow you to search and get the abstracts. And oftentimes you can get this identifier in the abstract, cut and paste it into the

[11:03] PsyHub page, and boom, the paper pops up. Now, the legality, nah, I haven't looked it up. I don't know. What do you think, Peter? If I don't know, is it okay? Can I, can I go, can I go, like, Tom Woodick on this if I have no idea whether it's illegal or not? It's okay to use it. You're the lawyer. I think you get one free pass. That's my official legal opinion. Do I get a lifetime free pass on the on using this one thing? Like in other words, like, I don't know if this is illegal. I'm not gonna look it up. Anyway, it's a fantastic way to go get it. So, um, when you are searching for things, in general, the way to find information is to think about, think about your problem and try to cast it in the most industrial light

[11:44] possible. So any sort of thing that you think that Campbell's soup might care about or anything that you think that, you know, Nabisco might care

[11:55] about, because these are the people that have money to pay for these kinds of studies. And that's in general how I find it. So I will, this week is extremely tough for me because the bar closing stuff, but I'm going to try to look up more on that because it leads me to another

[12:09] thing. When I realized that I had no idea, uh, what was um, going on with the dried beans. It also led me to, and also talking to, and thinking about, you know, the time that Booker and Dax has been

[12:23] open and every time I've been cooking is a concept of drift. And so, and I've been thinking a lot about it recently. So you get drift in your whole life. And what does that mean? So you have like, you come up with a recipe, you come up with a, with a technique, you implement it, you teach it, then that goes on autopilot, and just like a game of telephone, when you were a kid, you know, eventually there is drift in that

[12:49] technique and there's drift in the, in the end product. And so when you're running a restaurant, Or when you're running a bar, you know, you have to be, you have to set things in place to prevent your products, your techniques, your recipes from drifting too far from, you know, from where you

[13:10] started. Often, I mean, sometimes drift is good. Sometimes you start with something and the drift actually makes it better. Most of the time that's not the case. And even if it did make it better, you want to know why and then codify that. So I think, you know, a lot of, um, what I've been thinking about is that that kind of drift and control. And that's, I think, a couple weeks ago, we talked about the Eric repair story, Anastasia, where, you know, he has a very specific thing that will never drift, craft, Swiss cheese, and so they use that craft Swiss cheese, because that's palette drift.

[13:39] That's about your drift of palates over time and change, right? And so kind of locking into one idea to increase consistency. But the same is true. Same drift happens in your own mind. So most of the time, like, I know this is, you know, applies to me, especially, or anyone that, you know, works on a problem for a small amount of

[13:57] time and then compartmentalizes that and then puts it away, right? And then you tend to think, oh, I solve that problem. And Nastasia, you know this better than anyone. You've heard me say the same dang explanations like a 1000000000 times and demo to demo to demo. The problem is, is that most of the time, like your actual, you haven't done enough actual work at that beginning section to actually get the real answer,

[14:21] right? And you only marginally understand what you're talking about when you're actually doing all the

[14:26] hardcore work. So then like two, three, 4 years later, right? All you have left in your head are the results, and you don't remember any of the caveats, to the research that had you come up with those results, typically. So you'll think you have an idea locked down. And in fact, over the years if you don't revisit it and look back into it again, it turns out you know almost nothing at this point. And so, you know, trying to, one of the reasons this show is helpful for me

[14:52] personally to do it is that people ask me questions that make me

[14:56] re-examine, and Harold McGee is awesome at this stuff, constantly re-examining things that you hold, deer or hold as just kind of

[15:04] truths, and re-examining them down to a base level to try to re-understand what you're doing. And because

[15:12] almost, almost always, you know, you were wrong about something. You were wrong about some of your premises or something like that. So the bean thing got me thinking on that because it was something that, you know, I thought about a long time ago.

[15:24] Oh yeah, they dry they dry out as they get older, they get harder to cook. Clearly there's more going on and I need to go freaking research that thing. And in fact, almost all the questions this week are of that variety, things that I thought I knew something about. And then I looked into it only marginally, feeling that I could just come back with a quick snappy doodle

[15:44] answer, and it turns out it's a much more complicated problem. I mean, if you leave a dried bean out, like, what humidity level does it get to at the end of the eventually? Well, that's the thing, right? Let's say you live in, and this is something I don't know. Let's say you live in New Orleans, which is, you know, I don't know, not

[16:00] swamp, that's overstating it, but it's humid, right? So is it going to equilibrate to, in other words, even in a sealed environment where you're not, where you're not losing a lot of moisture, right? I think the beans, they change over time. There's I think there's a structural thing going on, right? So, increased moisture absorption. If it's just moisture, this could be overcome relatively quicker quickly with a longer cooking time. Or perhaps, let's say, you know, you're a believer in this current no soak thing,

[16:29] a soak, to increase or to retemper back up. But there's no indication on the dry bean. If that was the case, the dry bean council people would say, if you had some old beans, put like a moistened paper tally with the old beans for like a couple of weeks and then they'll be good as new again. That's how the bean council talks. Have you have you met the Bean Council? But that is, in fact, not what they say. I mean, now, look, the other thing you have to be very careful of is downloading the new iOS on your phone because it no longer freaking works. I'm trying to reopen the question. What you have to be careful of is that the Bean council has a vested interest in you throwing away your old beans and buying new ones. In reality, though, what they should do is tell you how to fix your old

[17:08] beans, because if you fix your old beans and have success, you'd be like, you know what? I actually enjoy cooking dry beans. I will purchase more dry beans. You know what I mean? Where instead you're like, they tell me I should throw it away. I'm going to get this package of beans. I'm never going to cook it. Then it's going to get too hard. I'm not going to know whether or not it's still good. I not going to sit around and try to cook these dried beans, and then they don't soften, and then what? dinner's ruined? No. And then they throw it away and they never buy dry beans again. See? That's my feeling. My feeling is is that if something appears like it's in your best interest, get people to throw away and buy fresh

[17:38] beans. Sometimes it's not in your best interest. Maybe there's an advantage. To what? The old beans? Yeah, yeah, you never know. Well, it's like often, like we have a question coming up soon on staling. And that, you know, so that's that's true. I love staled bread for other things. We'll get to that in a minute. About the new iOS. Have you downloaded it, Estasia? not allowed to. Please don't. Like, I can't, I was at a wedding on Sunday, and I'm like, oh, and my phone has been pestering me for weeks. Oh, update. Why do you update? You're going to sleep now. I could tell, can I update now? you're like, fine, fine. Jeez, jeez, you hit it. It updates. And then it no longer operates like a, this is why I thought that when Steve Jobs died, that I would be free of this sort of like tyranny of,

[18:22] of, of, yeah, enforced changes to the way that I use my device. The worst is like, unless you do something, it's going to update 30 seconds. Yeah, right. So the ghost of Steve Jobs came back and caused me to not get pictures of my friend's wedding because I gotten used to the fact that I could

[18:38] go shaboom and I take my phone and it turns into a camera instantly. I went, I did that, and then, like, sprays a bunch of garbage on the top of my screen is, like, press a button to continue. And then I pressed a button, but I obviously I pressed it too long. And series, like, may I help you? I was like, well, can you take the picture of the, you know, the bride that I wanted freaking 10 seconds ago and not have it look like I'm texting during the middle of a wedding

[19:00] ceremony by typing on my phone like a lunatic? She was like, I don't understand you, Dave. You know what I mean? Jerks. Jerks. Anyway, so... I heard about that, man. What a jerk, man. Texting in the middle of the... I know it. What kind of an what kind of a jerk shows up. It's a small wedding, too. It's like, you don't want, it's not like, wait, man. It's an important moment. Yeah. It's not like the lady die wedding where I'm one of like 8000000000 people. No one's like, you know, who's that idiot texting and then they draw a beat on me like the snipers draw a beat on me or something like this. You know what I mean? The best thing is it wasn't just like it looked like you were texting somebody, but having a really angry Texas guy with somebody. Oh, yeah, because you know what my face was looking at. I know exactly. Everyone else has, like, has this, like, you know, joy and like, and then I have this, like... Yeah, I've got like, I'm trying to use my eyes to drill holes through my telephone. Yeah. Nightmare. Okay, shy 2nd question. Additionally, how? And why? What? Why? Does the starch de gelatinization? I assume you mean recrystallization in stale bread cause it to have a chewy texture, and is this similar to moisture loss from worm bread exposed to the

[20:06] air worm? Uh, which can also lead to such texture, many things shy. No, so moisture, like staling is not moisture loss. And again, bread staling is a very, I'm going to do the Trump sniff from now on. Yeah, staling of bread is not primarily a... Dave, you're going to jail. Ava. Yes. But yes. Anyway, the staling is not... I mean, I'm sorry, like it's not a political show, but that debate was impossible to watch. If you were on either side of the fence, that debate was like so cringeworthy, right? I mean, weren't you just like, the whole time I was like, oh, this is my country. Right? Did you watch it, Peter? What were you like? Again, like not, like, don't talk about your political side, anything, but how do you feel? The whole thing is just painful. I mean, ideally what you want is just actual debate on the merits of things that matter. Yeah, no, we're beyond that. What we beyond that. We're beyond that. I think, but the thing is, I hate this in-between thing that's like watching like, you know, it's like watching, you know, meet the parents. It's just uncomfortable. You know what I mean? Uh, you know, some of the moments are funny, but it's an uncomfortable funny that makes me want to put my head in a paper

[21:24] bag. You know what I mean? It's like, we just need to have like a Jell-O match between these two. It's a joke. I mean, it's the kind of thing that people in other countries could point to and say like, yeah, I mean, it's just a total circus. Yeah, yeah. And it's the kind of thing that like John Stewart used to like make fun of other countries. and like, look at the parliament of blah, blah, blah, blah. You know what I mean? And like, look at the fistfighter, the parliament. aren't these people funny? Well, now it's us. You know what I mean? It's like, wow. Anyway, so uh, bread staling is not primarily a moisture loss, but and I remember... So I went to my, you know, my wife is very anxious for me to finish, and Nastasia is very anxious for me to finish the 2nd book that I'm supposed to be working on.

[22:04] So I, uh, I was like, how about this? The importance of moisture management. And Jen's like, Jen's like, are you an idiot? Or what kind of a moron? No one's going to buy a book on moisture management. And I was like, I was like, but Nastasia, I mean, Anastasia, because you also had the look. I was thinking to you now, because Nastasi's giving me the moisture management look, which is very close to the vegan face. giving Peter the moisture manager. Oh moisture. Anyway, so I was like, you know, I was telling my wife, I was like, look at, and telling you guys on the air, like, such a huge percentage of cooking problems in the world are moisture management problems.

[22:43] So everyone's like, why did, you know, why is the crust of the meat? Why is the skin bad? Because you don't know how to handle moisture management. Like, why is it, why is what's wrong with the bread? You have no understanding of moisture management. What's wrong with my pizza? Moisture management. I don't want Maria to, I want to get. I want to capture that look on her face. If I tell her, if I told my, if I told my editor, my, at the publisher at Norton, if I was like, hey, Maria, check this out for a book. How about this? The miracle of moisture management. It's all about that. So like people, like they think that they, they think that they can put like an instantaneous crust on the outside of something and then it's going to be good. No, you haven't removed enough moisture from the crust area to get it right. Like, what's wrong with my fried foods? You haven't managed, like, you haven't managed the balance between moist and non-moist. Same with potato chips, French fries, like almost anything that isn't a

[23:38] braise, and even braises have moisture management problems. cooking, cooking beans, cooking starches. Like why bread's stale in the 1st place, whether they'll go stale quickly is moisture management in the dough, right? And then how it stales itself is also a matter of moisture management as it goes out. So the miracle of moisture management, it turns out that no one thinks that that will sell. sells even less than cocktail books, which, you know, don't sell that well. But you know what I mean? your history of writing books will be liquid intelligence and then moisture management.

[24:13] Yeah. The miracle. The miracle of moisture management. That's going to be on like the $10 shelf management. $10 shelf. Do you remember when Borders used to exist and they had the like the $3, but it was a giant $3 book about like World War 2 airplanes? You could also get all sentimental, you know, thinking about like why my face is so

[24:34] tear stricken after our work meetings. It's a miracle of moisture management. Me managing your moisture. Exactly that. By the way, people, in meetings, I am the worst. I am the worst. I am the most inflexible weasel. in in a meeting. Like, the thing is, is that we have these meetings at the Museum of Food and

[24:55] Drink, where we're talking about the exhibition, and, and so Peter, here comes the most. So we're all sitting around this table, right? We're sitting around this table and we're trying to figure out how to do the best exhibition given the parameters that we have to work with. And when Peter comes to tell me something that he knows, I'm going to disagree with, right? I can tell because here's what here's what Peter does. He walks up, sits down and goes,

[25:24] And like deflates like half of his size. stares down at his like 50,000-year-old MacBook with half the keys

[25:32] missing and it's like, you know, I can just see it. I can just see the shoulders go down a little bit. And I'm like, Peter, man, I'm not so bad. And then he says something, and in fact, I am. In fact, I am. You know what I mean? It's like, and I'm not evil. I'm just not, you know. Oh, there goes the... Overclipped. Anyways, but like the moisture management. So, you know, it works with your colleagues, it works with your bread. Shattering dreams or shattering crust? Yeah, it's the same. So the deal is, what do you think, Dave? you think moisture management could be a book? No, right? I don't know. What about the miracle of moisture management? I mean, it does sound miraculous, but, you know, it's tough sell. It's got 3 M's in a row. What could be bad about 3 M's in a row? Yeah, everybody loves alliteration. Yeah, except for people. If you open something with the word country, do not spell it with a K, especially if there's a kitchen. You're two thirds of the way there. No good. Anyway, um, no color on the line if you want to take that next. Yeah, sure, let's do that. We'll talk about bread after we do the call. Call her, you're on the air. I did, this was Jeffrey in Costa Mesa, California. How you doing? How's it going? All right. All right. I'm one of the self-hating Californians. Sweet. Life is good. Nastasia got some blowback on my Twitter account, by the way, about the, who is it? Someone at Leapers was like, uh, California Hates U2, Nastasia. Strong. Give me a pound on that. Not true. Oh, nice. All right, go ahead. What you got for me? Wait, close to Mesa, isn't that where the bean place? Is that where they grow the beans? Is that where Rancho Gordo, Rancho, uh, later? Yeah, Rancho. Yeah, are they there? Is that where they are? Are you in Bean Man? Didn't catch the question. Oh, wait, like you said Custa Mesa, right? Is that where Rancho Gordo is? Is that where the beans are grown? Where is Costa Mesa? We're like south of Long Beach to south Los Angeles on the coast. Maybe, I don't know. All right, go ahead. I don't I don't believe we grow beans, but no. Oranges back in the day, but those are gone now. Really? Why? Because of the citrus greening or just because of economics? Or water? Too many people. Turns out people are worth more than oranges. No, we're not. Financial people seem to think. Um, yeah. Even in a drought, it's just pleasant here. kind of disgusting. Nice, nice. So I'm going to be installing. I'm going to be installing some foot pedal valves. Nice, good move. And the TNS brass ones. And my guys are kind of scratching their head on how to solve the problem. I know you'd mentioned before, there's a trick in basically allowing the hand cartridge valve to still work out the faucet.

[28:21] So they're they're trying to figure out how to have the foot pedal valve still work when the cartridge

[28:27] valve on the handle is in the closed position, how to how to sort of bypass that. All right, so I know that there's like a tea assembly that we need, but I'm wondering if you can give me some... So I've done this 2 ways. And I actually think the way that I did it, the 1st time was better. I'll tell you both ways. So, um, the, the way I originally did it and the way that I actually recommend is I physically separate out the, um, I separate the foot pedals from the, um, the hand

[28:54] cartridge and I have them mix in the gooseneck. And so what you do there is you get like a the base faucet, right, which is either going to be wall or deck mounted. And then you actually, you don't use the weird swivel fitting there. You just literally put, you get all chrome, chrome, uh,

[29:14] chrome tea fitting, and then, uh, chrome nipples. You get to choose the size, and then you screw them together. It's easiest if you're doing wall mount as opposed to deck, right? Because in a wall mount, your sink, the flanges on the sink go back to the wall, and then the tea can go back to the wall. You have to, and then you buy another flange, and you just work out

[29:34] the size of the chrome nipple, and what you end up with is a triangular flange,

[29:40] right? So you have instead of 2 flanges, going to the wall, you have 3 that go back. Then on the inside, once you mount it up, you screw

[29:47] the, uh, you screw the connector in, and then you just go direct on a regular brass fitting, you go a

[29:53] T into that 3rd T that goes into your gooseneck. And then that goes down with check valves to your foot pedals. And now your foot pedals operate completely independently of your foot cartridge.

[30:05] It doesn't matter what's going on. That worked fantastically. On my new one, actually, the foot pedals still work fantastically on this one. On my new one, what I did was I bought a TNS unit that came with a sprayer

[30:18] arm, right? Now, what I did there is I, the problem is most sprayer arms, right? What they do is they sense the pressure. And so if you if you push the spray arm and let water through there,

[30:32] uh, like a flat valve comes down and shuts off the water to the uh, to the regular faucet head. And I don't know if that would work with this. The one that I bought, the way it works is, is both the sink head and the sprayer arm can work at the same

[30:47] time and you have to push and rotate a valve to actually turn off the gooseneck. I hate this system. I hate it because pushing and turning is such a hassle. If it was one of those quarter turn cartridges, like that would be good. So what I'm looking to do now, you know, now it's a couple years later, is rip off the gooseneck that I have, and just screw another gooseneck on there and try to find an

[31:09] actual something that will shut the flow off to the gooseneck that's just a quarter of a

[31:13] turn and not some sort of push and twist like a childproof cap, which I freaking hate.

[31:17] But the way that that one works is very easy on the hookup for the foot pedals because what you do, and that one is deck mounted. So what you do is you just put your deck mount down, and that TNS one is designed to have a feed in from the bottom that is the spray arm. So where the spray arm goes in, I think you might have to get an adapter. I forget, but you just screw the T right there and feed feeding into that T, right, is the mix from your foot pedals and also the spray arm. So it's super easy. It's super easy there because you have that central connector going in. But if you're going to use a spray arm, which I love the spray arm. You need to think of some better way to switch off the, to switch off the top of the, of the gooseneck. The problem with... Could you see a way that the 1st option could work in a deck mounted situation? It's possible. I didn't research it because I knew I was moving. I thought I had solved it with a deck mount sink that I bought, but the problem with TNS Brass is that, I mean, I love their stuff and like it lasts a long time and you can get all the parts for it, but it's not something in general that you can just walk into a plumbing house and get there.

[32:27] It's better now. Like on Amazon, I think, carries some Tina stuff in K-Tom.com. Yeah, Web store has some of their... Yeah, and K-Tom does. The nice thing about K-Tom, at least it used to be, is, I think they're out of Florida, is that it used to be a pain in the butt because K-Tom had the best prices, and so I would call up TNS brass, and I would say, hey, and I would

[32:47] spend like, you know, 45 minutes on the phone with them, asking about exactly which adapter am I going to use, blah, blah, blah,

[32:52] blah, blah. And then I couldn't just order it from them because they don't do that way. And then I would call K-Tom and be at K-Tom, put in an order for this, and then they'd ship it out like a week later. Um, I don't know. I have to look at it and see whether there's some, uh, easy way. Well, it's there are easy ways. In other words, like, you could, they make just a flange, you can buy the flange, and then you can put the tea in. The problem is, is getting it to space nicely because if you're going to go deck and you want to drop that tea down, it's going to have to go tea and then over. So unless you want it to look completely whacked out nutty, right, you're

[33:27] going to have to have a relatively deep deck because it's going to have to go out the back of your faucet and down. So now, instead of mounting just a regular, I don't know, probably like 2 inch flange or something like

[33:38] that. you know, you need like a, you need like a 2.5 to 3 inch deck to mount it on, like now you're

[33:44] going to need that deck plus, however, like whatever the closest you can space that tea over, which is

[33:50] going to be at least an inch. So you're adding like at least an inch, probably closer to an inch and a half, you know, to the depth of your deck on the deck mount situation. And if you're willing to do that, it's like super easy. The one thing I don't know is I don't know. And once you do that, by the way, it's super easy to install the sprayer arm on it because now once you have a 3rd thing going down below the

[34:14] deck that happens like after the cartridge mixing, then you can you can tee that into your foot pedals and into a sprayer arm. And if you're doing that, right? The sprayer arm functions either with your hand mixers or with your foot pedals. Um, the, the issue is, is that most TNS brass, um,

[34:34] uh, shut off, like quarter turn shutoffs. This is what I used to have, right? What they do is, is they're designed to exclusively run a sprayer arm. And most of those situations are on dishwash pits. And in a dishwash pit, you're always using the sprayer arm and you have to tell it, hey, I want to use the

[34:51] gooseneck. So, and that's the way I used to have it. But if you're okay with the look of that, then it's like very easy because you could just buy they buy a separate gooseneck that comes up. And it has the quarter turn shut off for the gooseneck. You leave that on all the time so the gooseneck is default on, right? And then, and so you can buy a deck mount, a deck mount faucet without the

[35:13] gooseneck. You buy the add-on gooseneck, and then you have the tea that comes out and down, and then you buy the flange there and hook it into your spray arm and your foot

[35:24] pedals, and you should be good to go. I actually got used to having kind of the weird industrial chrome looking faucet

[35:30] thing and I actually loved it and liked it better than my system, but it's just a matter of mix and matching with all the

[35:35] TNS brass stuff. Okay. Um, I think that's enough to help. Thank you very much. Thank you. Let us know how it works out. All right, thanks Dave. All right. So back to the stale bread. So, um, it's not uh, strictly moisture loss, it's happening, right? Uh, it's actually uh, the uh, starch, and it's, but that's the thing, again, it's more complicated. When I went back to look into it, The research has changed. have done additional research since the last time I looked at it. But in general, what you're looking at is the starches are recrystallizing to an

[36:05] extent, and the moisture is migrating from the starch, sometimes to the proteins or into the matrix between where the starch used to

[36:12] be. And for instance, reheating the bread can cause those things, you know, cause them to reabsorb some moisture, decrystallize and get good again.

[36:21] once you do that, usually it turns to garbage quickly afterwards. But yeah, so it's more than just, it's more than just moisture loss. And by the way, the fact that it's a crystallization thing, if you think about it, this is why storing bread in the refrigerator makes you a complete enemy of

[36:34] quality because you're increasing the crystallization rate by lowering the temperature of the bread.

[36:40] That's why when you're freezing bread, you want to freeze bread right away, because when you freeze bread, it's the equivalent of the act of freezing it alone is the equivalent of at least a day's worth of just sitting out on your

[36:50] counter, and you want to thaw it relatively rapidly. You want it to be in that evil fridge zone for as short a period of time as possible. All right. So before we get kicked off, we should handle some Halloween questions. I should have done this one 1st and we get the folks in the chat room on with this and maybe Nastasia has some idea because Nastasia is the queen of the Halloween and Christmas. I know what I'm going to say. I exactly know what you're going to say, and that's why I want you to talk about it. Um, This is from Matt. Uh, hi, uh, cooking issues crew. I am looking to make some Halloween slash spooky. Themed cocktails for Halloween. So 2 questions. I'm using Fresh Concord Grace, but don't really have a way of juicing them and getting the seed out. Any thought on that without the aid of a juicer or can I just blend it all and then clear it with some pectinace or whatever? Look, you can blend Concord grapes, but it's gonna, the seeds get bitter. So, like, if remember the time that we tried it and it was like, ah, gross. All the seed particles and the thing was just nasty. We used the Santa after that. Yeah, but then, like, when I've done it without the Santa, like, I've literally just mashed it, like,

[37:52] like, uh, Lucille Ball making wine, uh, back in the, I love Lucy, you know what I mean? You mash the hell out of it, add your pectinace, uh, pectinace ultra SPL to the mash, and then just keep mashing it for a couple of hours, and eventually it will kind of liquefy, and then you press the stuff out in a sieve to get the juice out.

[38:09] I don't remember that working very well. Well, your yield is not as high as what we got, but it's, you know, it's hard. those were delicious cocktails we made. Yeah, the other thing you do, if you have kids or interns, is get them to see the Dan grapes. You know what I mean? You know what I mean? Then you can just blend the stuff. Those were delicious cocktails, but they were a pain. It was a pain. The Santa didn't crush the seeds, right? It's all a question of, of, of, yeah, but you lifted the, You jiggered it somehow. Well, yes. But the issue with mashing, it's hard. You need a, mashing is difficult because people want to try to,

[38:49] you're mash efficiency goes way down as soon as the depth you're mashing in goes

[38:54] deep and as soon as the area that the stuff you're mashing can move to goes wide.

[39:00] So if you have a deep bucket and you put a masher in to try to mash something, then all of the whole

[39:05] Concord grapes, just move out of the way of the masher as you push it through the stuff down the bottom. Women call men mashers back in the day. Mashers. Yeah, what does that mean? I don't know. I don't know I mean, it means like, it's like CAD. Do you know what I'm talking about? In those like cartoons? I thought we were talking about Concord grapes. I love that, you know, Nastasia? I appreciate that because that's like, that's an old school reference. Oh, yeah. It's always cool. And when I was a kid, I was like... Do you know how many things are in cartoons that you have no idea what they are and the kids still find them funny? Like, all the weird, like, topical references that nobody, like, do you remember when Yosemite Sam was, uh,

[39:43] remember when Bugs Bunny was supposed to get this guy Fearless Free to do the high diving act? And and Yosemite Sam's like, I'll pay my full business to see the high diving act. to see the high diving act. Remember that? Yeah, so like he... He's actually making a little pistol motion. Yeah, you have to make the pistol motions. So anyway, so the so but there's all sorts of weird topical references in that cartoon. That cartoon was hilarious growing up, but there's no like, like songs at the time. Open the door, Richard. you know that song? Anyway. Uh, but it doesn't matter. That stuff's still funny as heck, even though you don't understand the references. Honey tunes are timeless, man. Yeah, unlike unlike Shakespeare, where someone has to sit there and tell you what all the references are to what's going on in the Shakespeare. You're like, oh, now I get it. That was like a current poem that people read. It's because he would mash his genitals against females. That is disgusting. Who would do that? No, no, no, not Trump. Not a political show, not a political show, Dave. I think we're all on board with who we want, right? Not a political show. Not a political show. Well, we don't want people out. a political show. Alright. Mash your gendles. First of all, like. No, not like they're not out. It's still, but that's even, that's so pathetic. Imagine, like, you're like, eh, is this good? On a crowded train. on a crowded train. Right on the subway. That just seems like a not, like, how is that? See, that kind of thing can't be an attempt at a

[41:12] successful, a successful attempt. You're not attempting to actually get someone to go out on a date with you with that kind of a move, huh? Like, what are you getting? No, I mean, but a lot of stuff like, you know, cat calling and all that. It's not like you actually think the person's going to turn on and be like, hey, you know what? Let's go and get some dinner. Want to get a drink? Hey, sweet cheeks. Well, hello there. Yeah, yeah, I don't know. I don't really understand. don't understand. So is it really just to show off to your buddies? It's power move. Yeah, yeah. But it's not a power move. Or was there nobody's got a crowded train. Right, I don't know. Well, no, that's just a power of what? You can you can impose your own will on somebody else. Yeah, I think so. don't know. I can't even imagine. Masher. That's disgusting. Was that an urban dictionary or is that a real... Various sources. Nastasia's favorite uh, favorite place to look up her data, various sources. Again, back to Looney Tunes. You remember that when the king was trying to get, I think it was Yosemite Sam again, to cook Bugs Bunny, and he says every day, every day the same thing, variety. Remember that? The king went on it and he wanted Hassen Pfeffer as opposed to variety. totally meaningless. Do you remember this? And then Yosemite Sam was trying to cook Bugs Bunny. And you need to go. Is that where Bugs Bunny's like sitting back and like, it's a hot tub? Hot tub. Popping bubbly. Hot tub. Dude, did they not have Looney Tunes in Illinois? No, no, no. There are episodes where Bugs Bunny is like sitting in a cauldron and like chewing on a

[42:44] carrot irreverently. Well, maybe it is that one, actually. Maybe it is that one, but when you say, like, like, pop bubbles, I'm thinking of that like some... No, I was just from I was doing a reference to Fat Joe. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I moved to Fateau from Looney Tunes. Oh, I see. And then what's that song? Pop bottles, the other one, the more recent one? Who sings that one? Pop bottles. I can't actually sing a lyrics to that. Any, I can't find I can't think of any set of lyrics of that that's appropriate for me to sing. All right, so we went from Concord Grapes to genital mashing to Looney Tunes to Fat Joe. All right, well let's finish this. Any thoughts for spooky Halloween cocktails? This is the same question, believe it or not, folks. The last word looks sort of like a witches brew, but I'm not sure the best way to really make it pop. I could carbonate it, but I really want it popping up in your face to seem spooky. The other cocktail I'm thinking I'm making is something somebody you made before, Concord, grape, maple syrup, lemon juice, bourbon,

[43:45] Angostar, egg white, shaking, real frothy, and then 2 drops of pesos. Oh, not pastos, man, come on. Just don't just don't cough syrup in it if you're using patients. No offense, patience, people, but offense. It's good in a sense. don't mean to interrupt, but I'm gonna interrupt. Yeah, yeah. That my classic. Anyway, to show vampire teeth marks. All ideas appreciated things. I like the vampire in the egg foam. a good idea. I mean, pay shows, you know, I'm not for it, but, you know, whatever. So, uh, okay, if you're gonna do a, I mean, everyone's like, oh, this is for kids, adults freaking love a hunk of dry ice in

[44:14] the car. Dry ice, I was gonna say, yeah, man. Adults freaking love it. And then especially... There's pizza with greens here, so don't the people here will, more reports on that next week. When we ask for a pizza with greens, it'll be like, we don't do that. We don't do that. It's going to happen. I guarantee you, Nastasia, how much you want to be? You won't bet me. And there's like prosciutto on top. It's like, I would love that pizza. So listen, when you're doing, if you're going to do a punch of dry ice, make sure you don't put, make sure you don't put,

[44:39] um, uh, dry ice in anyone's cup for any reason, shape, form, whatever. Activated charcoal, black, like the superpowders that people use for health reasons, which I think is crazy, but

[44:50] whatever, but, you know, that goes and drinks, a lot of people done that, and black drinks are creepy.

[44:56] And if you use enough of it, all your all your customers or guest teeth will become black, which is also really creepy for them. What if you had like cobwebs from like cotton candy or something? And what? Cotton candy for cottonwoods. It would melt, man. You could put some on top. That's what I mean. Don't put silly string in your cocktails. Here's another one. Nastasia has been, and Nastasia and I, don't say the name of the book. I want the price to go even higher. But, uh, Nastasia, we, turns out is obsessed with this, says she told me about it. I don't remember. And then I mentioned it to her, Applehead dolls. Oh, yes. Has a garnish. Yes. Yeah, Appleheads. Apple and dolls. So look up the old Vincent Price, Applehead Doll kit. So what you do is you take, you take an apple, you peel all but the top and the bottom, leave that intact, then

[45:44] carve, like carve a face in it, right? Soak in lemon juice a little bit if you want. I don't know why it's going to go brown anyway, but they say to do that. Carve a face in it, and then soak it in salt for, um, I don't know, like

[45:57] a salt water for like a day or so. And that's to, I think, I don't know why everyone does that. Some of that's probably just osmotic to pull the water out of the apple and also probably to help keep it from Sperlin as it as it dries down and then dry that sucker down. like stick it on a chopstick or whatever, and or wire, and dry it, uh, or you hang it or what, or stick it up and dry it for a week. If you have a h dehydrator, you can do it quicker. If you buy the Vincent Price. The Vincent Price, Applehead maker, literally is like a case that goes around a 60 watt light bulb and probably has caused more house fires than any other Vincent Price branded toy in history, of

[46:36] course. And what's the ultimate cocktail, Halloween cocktail? The ultimate Halloween cocktail is to make a wine zombie. And Nastasia should post on her Instagram account, wine zombie instructions. Peter, what is your experience with the Wayne Zoe? Um, I basically drank kamikaze straight out of the wine zombie. Not knowing it was kamikazis. And then, um... Blacked out. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah. So the way a wine zombie works is you go to your local Halloween shop and you buy a you buy a zombie mask and then you put it, you build like a wire armature, you put a zombie costume over it with hands, and then you just put a punch bowl in there, you drill a hole in the

[47:17] bottom and jam a rubber tube in, and then you put it on like a circulator or whatever pump. Then you add all of your cocktail to that bucket. And then the tube out of the circulator, pump whatever goes into the mouth of

[47:30] the of the zombie mask that I guess you put it over a mannequin head, right? Styrofoam head, and then dumps into the bowl. So it's just a zombie puking. And I think for this, a red cocktail is appropriate. puking zombie, blood, cocktail, punch, and you can have like a hunk of dry ice in the punch bowl to keep it cold as it's

[47:49] circing. And so he's puking into a frothy, like steamy zombie thing. And a zombie hit. Later, you're puking into a. Yeah, now, Nastasia, Nastasia, you know, believe it or not, even though, even though she is sometimes a just get or done enemy of

[48:05] quality. It's good enough kind of a person. That's what this was. No, but you went full on and you did you did a standing wine zombie. You did a Santa. And then and zombie, right? Oh, yeah. Yeah. And, but, but if you, your 1st wine, your 1st wine zombie out the gate, I recommend doing a bust only zombie, that you can, you know, put on a tabletop, like a tabletop mounted zombie, but if you want to go full Nastasia and Piper, shout out to Piper

[48:34] Christopher. He said he gave up all IP on that. Well, you still have to give him credit for working on it. You have to give him money, but you have to give him credit. So if you need plans, Nastasia should sell kit plans for wine zombies because it's wine zombie year. And then the good thing is, is that with a very small amount of repurposing, you can do what Nastasia also did it, the Del Posto

[48:53] party, which is the puking Santa, whereas Santa's puking up mold, and that was a hot one. That's very good. Like a hot, like a mold, uh, mulled wine. You didn't mold wine, right? Like a glug, like a Santa puking up a glug, and Nastasi, again, took it one level further. Actually recorded her friend Phil Bravo, like making Santa

[49:13] comments, like, too many cookies, what? And then, like, puking up the mull wine. You know what I mean? best work with Dave. Yeah, yeah. Those are the days. Oh, now you're making me think of the Archie Bunker song. That's a good show. On the fan. Got to wrap it up, Dave. All right. So, listen, I have some questions I didn't get to. They are on zucchini pieces. I don't see who sent that in, but it's about zucchini, residue, and sticking. And again, much more complicated than I thought. You ever, remember, I've said this on the air a bunch of times. When you when you skin pumpkins, you get that weird oozi latex that

[49:50] like causes that disgusting skin to form on top of your already disgusting

[49:53] skin, you know what I mean? Yeah. And so it turns out that there are these crazy exudates in

[49:59] cucubits and zucchini, cucumber, pumpkin, all cucubits, and some have it more than others, these weird exudates, and so I'm

[50:07] going to look into that because I think that's an interesting subject.

[50:10] And I also have to get next week to, um, ooh, replicating other cooks dishes and when it's okay, when it's a rip. Uh, and we have a question on some high-tech equipment uh, from Simone and Montreal, we're going to get to next week. What do you want, Peter? And go to ChowCHOW.mofat.org and get your tickets to see Child the Making of Chinese American Cuisine and then see Dave, me, maybe Stas. I don't know if she'll be there. Because if you don't, give me the give me the moisture management, Peter, if we don't make it. If you don't, then it was just going to be in so much trouble. We'd appreciate the support. So it starts at 30 bucks and up, you can come and see the exhibition. So get out there. chow.mofa.org. Thanks. Cooking issues.

[51:02] Thanks for listening to this program on Heritage Radio Network.org. You can find all of our archived programs on our website, or as podcasts in the iTunes store by searching Heritage Radio Network. You can like us on Facebook and follow us on Twitter at Heritage underscore radio. You can email us questions at any time at info@heritageradionetwork.org. Heritage Radio Network is a nonprofit organization. To donate and become a member, visit our website today.

[51:32] Thanks for listening.